Jones, Toney, Hopkins, Calzaghe - ATG list

I had to note my quote in purple. Previous note, please see.
In answer to your question I could say does Hopkins?
When Hopkins has fought a good fighter his own size (except for Tarver who had been beaten 3 times already) he lost ie Jones, Taylor twice and Calzaghe. His big name wins are aganst naturally smaller fighters. Dont gat me wrong I think hes a good fighter and HOF fighter but just trying to take all in account

 

Did Calzaghe face a naturally smaller fighter when he fought Hopkins?

Hopkins was Middleweight champ, Calzaghe fought his whole career at Supermiddle or above.

I agree with you though that theres not much between them. I would give Hopkins the nod, but I agree with some of what your saying.

And fair play to giving credit to Toney :good

 

You are a complete moron... A Rico wannabe.... Wow, ESB is truly getting sad when idiots think it is cool to act like Rico.

Not only your bull**** hatred for Roy Jones makes you a moron, but that whole post was littered with contradictions.... You really need to stop posting.

You honestly think Calzaghe is more of an ATG than Jones Hopkins and Toney????

And Jones was at the very bottom of your list, even though he holds 2 decisive victories over a near Prime Hopkins, and Prime Toney.. (two other people on the list)

You criticize Jones for fighting garbage men, but have Calzaghe at the top of the list even though he BY FAR fought the lower level of opposition.

Like I said, Moron.:deal

 

Jones - Superman in his prime. He was the man to beat. Moved to heavy and grabbed a minor title. Effective from middleweight to (limited) heavy. Risk-adverse attitude hurts his career - failed to rematch Hopkins but no fault of his. Failed to fight DM, but DM at fauly. Failed to fight Eubanks & Benn and a few others. But still a great resume.

Toney - Most skilled. Fought from 160 to fat heavy. Fought and won to boxers which all other 3 would lose to as well. But he was the only one to really push himself. Hurt by inconsistancy and poor discipline. Most active of the four.

Hopkins - Was at the top of his game longer than others. dominant at middle for MANY years - nothing wrong with that but hurts in P4P ratings by not moving up in weight compared to Jones and especially, Toney. Needed quality opposition to be exciting. Boring style to the casual fan. Hurt by lacklustre and poor opposition at middle. Awesome technician...but low output later in career. Great discipline.
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Calzaghe - does not belong here. Greatly skilled and incredible level of fitness, output, and adaptability. Happy to wallow in obscurity for 80% of his career placing himself in the p4p neighbourhood of a Brian Neilson until he finally stepped up. Undefeated record but least active of the four. Beat a still dangerous but older Hopkins. Good retirement time places himself higher in many eyes. Great career from a managerial standpoint.

 

Good Post:good

I would probably swap Hopkins with Toney, but I agree with what you are saying.

 

When you make that statement you also have to answer the question: Would Calzaghe ever have been able to make 160 or 155 pounds like Hopkins?

 

Head to head Prime vs Prime
1. Jones
2. Toney
3. Hopkins
4. Calzaghie

Career acomplishments. (championships quility of wins)
1. Jones
2. Toney
3. Hopkins
4. Calzaghie

Talent/Skills
1. Jones
2. Toney
3. Hopkins
4. Calzaghe

Overall
1. Jones
2. Toney
3. Hopkins
4. Calzaghe

 

1. Jones

His dominance is almost unmatched throughout history. He won titles in four weight classes and was the first Middleweight more than 100 years to win the HW title. He holds wins over Hopkins and Toney both of which are involved here. H2H he is one of the best fighters p4p as arguably nobody beats him at 160 and 168. He matches up pretty well in the LHW as only a handful (if that) beat him at this weight. His losses against Tarver, Johnson, Calzaghe and Green should not affect his legacy too much as he was past his best days in these fights.


2. Bernard Hopkins

His Middlweight reign puts him in the Middleweight pantheon with Monzon, Hagler and others. He took on all comers at 160 and unified the titles with a smaller but formidable and 40-0 Felix Trinidad. Jermain Taylor ended his Middlweight reign with two controversial victories. Hopkins then moved up and dominated Tarver while being the heavy underdog. His loss against Jones affects him a bit but still he keeps a high rating here. His loss against Joe Calzaghe isn't enough to drop him lower than Joe or Toney, he was 44 there and wasn't the same monster he was against Trinidad.

3. Toney

His longevity in 83 fights is underrated when James Toney comes up when rating him. He was the second fighter in 100 years after Jones to win the HW title but was later caught for steroids which stripped him of the title. He won the MW title from the highly skilled Michael Nunn who was 36-0. He had a decent reign but stole a victory away from Dave Tiberi in which he performed poorly. He moved up to Super Middle and holds wins over McCallum, Barkley and Littles. He was dominated by Jones over 12 and was nearly shut out in that fight. He moved up to light heavy and proceeded poor performances against Griffin and Thadzi. He resurged his career by making a good CW run and beating Vassily Jirov despite being the underdog. He moved up to HW and built himself a solid resume despite being greatly undersized.

4. Calzaghe

Being undefeated means something even if someone fights stiffs his whole career says Larry Holmes. I agree with this statement and think that Calzaghe had an OK resume. He won the title from an old Eubank but still a solid win for a young fighter like Calzaghe. He is the greatest of all time at 168 based on accomplishments but not H2H as I rate him below Jones in that department. He holds solid wins over Reid, Sheika, Woodhall, Lacy, Sika and Kessler at 168. He moved up to beat the still formidable but old Bernard Hopkins. To cap off his career he beat the shell of Roy Jones Jr. in a meaningless fight that was 10 years too late.

 

1.Bernard "The Excutioner" Hopkins
2.Roy Jones Jr
3.James "Lights Out" Toney

 

so no one is going to give james credit for beating doug dewitt,reggie johnson,prince charles willams all world champs plus then undefeated merqui sosa,an tim littles solid contenders to go along with other champs listed on resume.1a toney 1b jones 3 hopkins 4 joe

 

ding ding ding!!! We have a winner!!!:d

 

A Rico wannabe? Why, because I too know a Glass Jawed joke when I see one? Or is it the Glass Jaw avatars, which incidentally I created.atsch

I can't believe you rate a steroid-injecting, fat illiterate pea-brained idiot such as James Toney ahead of Joe Calzaghe. That shows your clear bias. You are a complete and utter Roy Jones fanboy nuthugger. It's enough to make one want to vomit.:barf:rofl

And you say that Jones' opponents were better than Calzaghe's. How so? Calzaghe fought full-time boxers. Jones fought part-time boxing hobbyists who worked the firestations and sanitation plants of Backwater, Idaho or Bum****, Tennessee.

 

Well F***ING Said!!!!!:good

 

LOL..... ya got me.

 

Reluctantly, I concur.