Harry Greb, head to head vs. the great middleweights

I assume he was hard to hit clean, but slick defensive sounds inaccurate. Either way people pointing to his footage bring a valid point, he doesnt look impressive, maybe he was better in the ring and his style is obviously effective for the era, would it be effective against ATG from other eras, Im unconvinced

 

In context, Loughran was green as grass with a tiny number of fights, Tunney was pre-prime having never competed at the top level, Gibbons aging past his prime, and Walker giving up 7lbs in the ring

 

The same "green as grass" Tommy Loughran beat Mike McTigue, Jeff Smith and fought evenly with Gene Tunney.

"Pre-prime" Tunney who had never competed at the top level had already beaten former champ Battling Levinsky and it's not like Tunney had an easy time with Greb in 1924 either in a disputed 10 round fight that could have gone either way based on newspaper reports.

Gibbons was hardly "aging" and "past prime", he had not been beaten in 7 years.

 

No, apparently, the much heralded newspaper reports which are clung onto for reference had, in general, Tunney winning easily because Greb withdrew into his shell because he was getting battered.

 

You're talking about their last fight when Greb was outweighed by 15 pounds against a man who soon dethroned Jack Dempsey.

 

My bad

 

I'm not completely discrediting the wins but the facts point to the fact Tunney and Loughran both improved after their first Greb losses, Tunney ended up coming out on top at the end of the series after improving, Loughran ended the series 1-1-1 too indicating he had caught Greb up at the end.

Neither had hit prime when Greb first fought them, neither started competing at the top level until then, Loughrans Smith series came after several Greb losses, Tunneys best win was Levinski pre-Greb when Leinski had dropped to gatekeeper level

Mike Gibbons was 32, that was pretty old back then and he'd beat Greb prior to that. A good win but not a prime Gibbons

All very good wins but context is important

 

When have I ever slated anything but how he looks? I'm not questioning the guy's legacy, I'm just making an observation on how dreadful he looks on the film available.

 

Power Puncher, Your facts dont hold water...Where to start?...Gene Tunney ,fought Harry Greb bfrom the ages of 25 to 28 years old...Prime age ror a fighter..Hev had already won the title from Battling Levinsky,fought Tommy Loughran,was undefeated, and WEIGHED about 13-15 pounds more than a fading Greb who had over 240 fights by that time,and was sightless in one eye by then...Another fallacy on your part..Tommy Gibbons when he was boxing Greb outweighed Harry b 15 or more pounds, and from 1922 t0 1924 knocked out 28 out of about 32 opponents, including a great KID NORFOLK...Point of fact in 1921 Gibbons knocked out 21 opponents ,ten in the first round.....Not bad for a FADING fighter as you described him...For Greb ,who you demean,should be praised to even beat a bigger ,and strong Gibbons...Finally, I had to chuckle at your comment that after all Grebg outweighed Mickey Walker by about 7 pounds...True ,Greb past his prime did weigh 7 pounds more than the great Walker,but you conveniently forget that the Pittsburgh Windmill licked DOZENS of 15 to 50 pound.great fighters, maybe 100 times or more, in his amazing career...Another thing this silly notion that Greb looked not impressive sparring and that people somehow moved differently then...Well I can assure you that my father,and folkes of his time, yes even Harry Greb'walked and boxed the same way, as todays "advanced boxers" do.Evolution is not that fast....

 

Prove it.

 

Well lets look at what we have actualy got.

We have film of Greb shaddow boxing, and film of Greb sparring with a 60 year old Philadelphia Jack O'Brien who he is probably trying not to hurt.

We don't have any film of him actualy fighting.

Against that, his resume is the best of any of the five fighters on that list (except perhaps Langford who did most of his work at heavyweight), perhaps better than two of their resumes put together.

The fighters on that list might beat Mickey Walker or they might not but they would all be long shots against sombody like Gene Tunney.

 

These reports would judge Greb on the standards of the day. It's not proof at all. I'm judging on what I can see, not reading what other people see. At the time his style must have been effective, evidently given his record. However, that doesn't mean he was some kind of sweet science guru who ate lightening and crapped thunder. I'm judging on what I can see, and what I can see is a guy who is far from technically brilliant.