Anyone see '79 Larry Holmes losing a classic matchup? I don't!

Holmes was a helluva fighter no doubt about it but he certainly wasn't unbeatable even at his best. No fighter is for that matter. When Shavers decked Holmes in thier 2nd fight he should've finished him but he lacked the skills to properly set him up for the KO. If that was Joe Louis who decked Larry and had him on shaky legs he would've finished him. So would've Dempsey and Tyson if they were in the the same situation as Shavers was. Ali at his best did everything Holmes did and a little better as well and had a better chin to boot. If Mike Weaver could Larry all sorts of hell don't you think a prime Joe Frazier could as well and maybe more? I think when we're talking about ATG fighters we have to admit that on any given night any one of them could be beaten by the right opponent. Larry would be favored over some of them based on style differences but he would also be a slight underdog against some others for the very same reason. That doesn't diminish Holmes who is right up there with all the other ATG's but it just puts things in perspective. At least that's the wat I see it.

 

Sorry Axl, but I'd much rather put the Tyson that dismantled Biggs than the Tyson that blew away a blown up light heavyweight in one round. And since you're so closeminded as to say Wlad is a bum, I'm not going to even comment about that.

 

Holmes 79 opponents:
Shavers 2 years past the Ali fight and Weaver
was close to becoming WBA champ.

1980-02-03213½Lorenzo Zanon215

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Caesars Palace, Las Vegas, Nevada, United StatesWKO615
~ time: 2:39 | referee: Ray Solis | judge: Chuck Minker 49-44 | judge: Art Lurie 49-45 | judge: Harold Buck 48-46 ~
~ WBC heavyweight title ~
1979-09-28210Earnie Shavers211

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Caesars Palace, Las Vegas, Nevada, United StatesWTKO1115
~ time: 2:00 | referee: Davey Pearl | judge: Al Miller 98-91 | judge: Lou Tabat 98-89 | judge: Harold Buck 98-90 ~
~ WBC heavyweight title ~
Holmes was down in the 7th.
1979-06-22215Mike Weaver202

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Madison Square Garden, New York, New York, United StatesWTKO1215
~ time: 0:44 | referee: Harold Valan 107-101 | judge: Tony Castellano 106-102 | judge: Harold Lederman 106-103 ~
~ WBC heavyweight title ~
Weaver was down once in the 11th round.
1979-03-23214Ossie Ocasio207

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Hilton Hotel, Las Vegas, Nevada, United StatesWTKO715
~ time: 2:38 | referee: Carlos Padilla | judge: Art Lurie ~
~ WBC heavyweight title ~
1978-11-10214½Alfredo Evangelista208¼

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Caesars Palace, Las Vegas, Nevada, United StatesWKO715
~ time: 2:14 | referee: Richard

 

I can see Muhammad Ali circa 1965-1974 doing it. A peak Joe Frazier, would give a 50/50 shot. The same with a prime Ken Norton. This will probably surprise a lot of people,but an ageing Norton still gave Larry a hell of a scrap in '78.

 

Absolutely. It's going to take a finisher to get rid of Holmes. The first finisher he faced, he lost to. He was stopped 2x i9n the amateurs against a finisher. Whole different ballgame in there against world class finishers than the guys that can just hurt you and don't capitalize. Larry is smart enough and has the recouperative powers to slip thru the cracks against those guys.

 

Muhammad Ali 1964-67 beats any version of Larry Holmes, the video evidence is there.

It would always be a competitive fight but Ali was a man that could match or better anything Holmes tried in there.

Both at their best.... Ali wins 10-5/9-6.

No knockouts or knockdowns in this one tho, a tactical match that Ali`s crisper combinations, quicker hands & feet see him through on a clear points win.

 

Forgot to mention, I rank Larry Holmes 3rd behind only Muhammad Ali & Joe Louis, a truly amazing fighter.

Ps. I think Tyson, Liston, Foreman, Frazier & Louis all have very good chances vs Holmes in prime H2H fights also but Ali is the only one Id put a good bit of cash on to beat him.

 

Why the **** are you laughing ? :huh

Foreman knocked out Frazier twice, no other fighter came close, Holmes aint any tougher than Joe Frazier & he could never have came up with a gameplan like Ali did in Zaire to turn the tables, a prime Holmes was no more mobile nor better defensively than a 74 Ali & that version of Ali couldnt keep the pace to escape Foreman when he was cutting the ring off.

I personally cant call a Foreman-Holmes fight but to laugh at someone picking George by KO is a bit strange IMO.

 

i agree: i feel this one is a pick em fight. i feel that holmes would edge it but i'm not confident enough to put money on it. Just as easy as a holmes win is a Foreman knockout. Shavers may have hit harder than foreman but Big George was a better finisher, as was Louis and Dempsey as previously stated

 

I have always wondered myself, if Foreman might prove to be a stumbling block for Holmes.. At first thought, Holmes seems like a perfectly logical favorite over Foreman, due to George's difficulty with world class boxers combined with Holmes' incredible recuperative powers..But as we all know, Larry held is left hand low, leaving himself open to be hit with right hands, a flaw that he never fully corrected.. I'm also not sure that he had the ability to linger on the ropes or in a corner, should George ever pin him there.. Lastly, Foreman could hit hard in both hands, and unlike Shavers, was capable of a two-fisted attack.. For the record, I would always favor Holmes for reasons that I listed before, but its not a forgone conclusion..... Foreman would have a good chance in this one...

 

My top 3 are the same,Bill.

 

i agree that holmes was more fluid that the zaire/74 ali but foreman at that time was a beast with a terribly underrated jab. if larry tried to outjab him and move, he may find himself getting walked down and walked over. he would have had to constantly move and tie up foreman: i know he has the ability but did holmes have the mind frame to do this?

 

That's a reasonable assessment, however even when Holmes was at the peak of his powers from 1978-1982, he was still proven vulernable and even came very close to being beaten by lesser fighters than Foreman...

 

:goodgreat post and great analysis