My stab at a top 20 HW List

Why?


He beat Floyd Patterson 2x, Cleveland Williams 2x, Eddie Machen, and Zora Folley. All of these men were in their primes. All of these men could have been highly competitive in any era with the talents they showcase on film. Patterson is typically ranked among top 20 heavyweights of all time(you rank him # 14), while Machen Folley and Williams usually get placed in the top 50. Liston also beat a solid list on 2nd tier contenders like Nino Valdes, Mike Dejohn, Johnny Summerlin 2x, Roy Harris, and Wayne Bethea.


I think his resume was filled with both quality and quantity. What don't you like about it?

 

Tier 1
Joe Louis
Muhammad Ali

Tier 2
Rocky Marciano

Tier 3
Jack Johnson
Larry Holmes
Lennox Lewis

Tier 4
James J. Jeffries
George Foreman
Evander Holyfield

Tier 5
Sam Langford
Joe Frazier
Mike Tyson

Tier 6
Max Schmeling
Floyd Patterson
Sonny Liston

Tier 7
Jack Dempsey
Harry Wills

Tier 8
Ezzard Charles
Jersey Joe Walcott

Tier 9
Bob Fitzsimmons
Jack Sharkey
Wladimir Klitschko

Tier 0
Jim Corbett
Max Baer


My placements of Patterson and Schmeling may be seem to high to some but I like where they are. I´m very happy with my list these days.

 

Me too. I could drop Dempsey off but his legend keeps him at #10. I also think I have Holyfield #11. Liston is in that 10-12 range currently.

 

Corbett over Sullivan?

 

Its a pretty good list, Though I think Bowe is a little bit high for me.


I agree with MOST of the placements.

 

Sullivan is a bit odd since he build a part of his resume fighting without gloves.

One that possibly should be included there is Peter Jackson.

 

Whats forgotting is Sullivan was pretty much shot by the time of Corbett and Jackson, I belive had Corbett not taking Sullivan out, Jackson would have, with out the color bar.

Prime for Prime is a close call imo. But in the 1890's Sullivan was at the end of the trail, the lost to Corbett(OR Jackson in this image world) Should not affect Sullivan in rankings imo.

 

Patterson over Liston?

 

You know what a Tier-System is, right? And if you look a bit closely inside the tiers the fighters are ranked chronological.

But aside of that, I argued in another thread that you could put Patterson above Liston, not much but a bit.

 

I think that's a bit much considering Liston demolished him twice. I don't think Patterson did enough else to separate himself. His reign was nothing spectacular either. Liston accused of him of ducking black fighters.

 

Totally depends on your criteria. I don´t rate h2h or ability when compiling a list. But I do rank achievements and Patterson scores high there with him beeing the youngest and first two time hw champ. And him fighting bigger fighters thoughout his career, having a slightly better longevity at the top evens out Liston´s wins over him. You could make arguments. I know you don´t want to see them but they are there.