In your eyes who won Ali-Frazier III?

Muhammad Ali won the fight, and was close to losing the "event" but won it

 

Ali won. I'm glad he did. I can't stand Frazier's style.

 

Thank you Bill for saving me the time to write the above!!!

 

:good

 

What do you mean by that?

 

Well put!!!

 

:good

:good

 

I had Ali slightly ahead after 14 rounds.

 

Immediately after it was over, Don Dunphy asked Ali, "Did you have any doubt about winning at any time?" Muhammad told him, "Well, round ten. I was surprised Joe had so much stamina." There was absolutely nothing about Ali wanting to quit before touching gloves for the final round. He was highly complementary of Frazier afterward, in part to further enhance his legacy. Ultimately, the things he subsequently said have to take a back seat to the things he actually did throughout his career.

Five years later (almost to the day), in a hopelessly bleak situation against Holmes, he wanted to come out for round 11, but Dundee overruled him and Bundini Brown. Muhammad admitted the following morning that Angelo made the right call, but there was no quit in Ali himself that night. He never went down despite a frightful beating.

Even if Muhammad had somehow contemplated packing it in at Manila, Dundee would have sent him back out, just as he did when Ali was blinded against Liston. There is no possibility that Joe could have won, and virtually no chance that Smoke would have reached the final bell, given what referee Padilla said about allowing him perhaps 45 seconds to mount a rally before calling a halt. Also, do not forget that the crowd in Manila was behind him, and Ali had responded to their chanting of his name earlier between rounds. He was drawing energy and inspiration from their vocal support.

Muhammad didn't quit when Norton broke his jaw, he wasn't stopped when blinded by Liston, and his chief second made the decision to stop the proceeding against Holmes, despite Ali's willingness to continue. There is no truth, no substance to the allegation that he wanted to quit in Manila after 14, and no possibility that he would have retired on his stool if Frazier hadn't been.

 

Was ringside in the new Garden for Ali-Frazier I. The pre-fight tension was unbearable. Reminded me of SRR's return bout with Turpin.

 

What about Ali's collapse after the fight?

 

Ali.. I hate it when people say otherwise. Honestly, Joe was blind, eating right hands, and I think he was behind.
AND! On boxing rec, it clearly has Ali, by TKO victory.
What other proof could you want? It was certainly close though. Joe was just looking too lethargic and wasn't bobbing and weaving enough to do anything in the 15th round. I honestly think he would get knocked out in that round.

 

yeah, but neither of them are as skilled as Valuev, right? I guess you think Valuev would outlast Ali in such a war?

 

Holmes collapsed like this after Norton. It tells me that they were willing to push their bodies as hard as necessary to prevail for as long as it took them to compete. Joe had the energy to stand up and briefly protest Futch's decision to stop it. After the FOTC, it was Smoke who was more expended. In Manila, Frazier's momentary burst of dissent suggests to me that he may have failed to put as much of himself into the effort as Muhammad did. In both Manila and the FOTC, the victor was the one who pushed himself more to prevail.

Muhammad was never going to collapse as long as the competition lasted. Earlier in the year, he also dropped to the deck in exhaustion after similarly expending himself late to avenge Tony Perez's ruled knockdown at Wepner's hands. Ali was a beast when the bell rang for round 15. He got up in the FOTC to arguably win the remainder of that round, stopped Bonavena and Wepner within that three minute period, and later nearly took out Shavers after being knocked silly repeatedly. Wepner was the victim of a very impressive accumulation of punishment dished out over the championship rounds. In Ali's previous outing, Joe Bugner made Muhammad do most of the work during the daylight hours of the Kuala Lumpur blast furnace.

Ali did not train as hard for Manila as he should have, but his competition readiness could not have been more perfect, and no quality of training can compensate for a lack of battle hardened readiness and sharpness (just as any competitive Kentucky thoroughbred has to be raced into condition). If Wepner had not been awarded a knockdown, Muhammad would have cruised throughout. Instead, his insulted pride made him push himself in a way which reaped huge dividends for him in Manila. What makes Joe's performance so phenomenal, is that this was probably the absolute most difficult post exile version of Ali for him to try attempting to defeat.

 

Man, out of all fights in history, that would be the one i'd like to see most. Two amazingly talented and dedicated fighters pitted against each other in their primes (not peaks, before the Ali-army starts crying) with a great build-up. Not often does the event live up to its hype, but this clash of styles and Ali being forced to dig deeper than he ever did, is just fantastic... i've seen it a million times. Much better match than their 3rd.