Light - Heavyweight History Hd 2 Hd debate

I've studied both these guys for years and I believe a 100% that Archie would win this fight, if you ever watched the first Montell Griffin fight, watch how much trouble his crouching style ( similar to Moore) while boxing on the back foot gave Roy fits and is able to make Roy miss, well I believe Archie the genius that he was would know that the best way to beat Roy is to make him come to you, Archie's got the ring smart's to give Roy nightmare's,

I'll leave it at that for now, what your case for a win for Roy

 

The case is not purely stylistic, but that Moore is beatable. I suppose if i'm being fair i should consider the so-called best versions of both, but my method of being fair is to take the fighter in his prime and basically assess him on average in that time frame. That's why i don;t like it when people say 'Montreal Duran is unbeatable', because Montreal Duran and the Duran of the next fight is hardly a different fighter, i can;t rate things that are ultimately merely speculative. It's the same with Tyson, '88 Tyson is unbeatable', but 90 Tyson got ruined by Buster Douglas? It annoys me to be honest. And Tyson and Duran are my 2 faves ever, and i'm passionate about that.

So imo, Moore has been beaten by fighters in and around his prime that are not as good as Roy Jones. I was watching Hopkins-Jones 1 today (and i know its at 160), and Hopkins only comes into effect when he gets Jones' back against the ropes, its the same with Tarver. Moore wasn't the type to back his man up with raking jabs but he could launch attacks that were born of shots that landed without the opponent seeing them coming. He does that to effect here and he won't need a gameplan, because he'll just ko Roy imo.

Moore was not just a wildman aggressor as you know, he was a quality boxer in mid ring, his defense, countering and feints are some of the best to ever be displayed in a ring p4p. But i don't think that taking part in a mid-ring chess match is quite the best idea when fighting Jones, because the speed at which he throws powerful shots at you is unreal. I also think Jones can hurt Archie. Charles put Moore out cold and Jones was some puncher himself, though the tecnique on Charles' shots are vastly superior to Jones; it must be said.

I'm not convinced either way yet though. I was thinking of the Griffin fight myself, and if Moore can do that to effect he has a good chance of just countering Roy and taking him out. Moore is the greatest champ in the history of the division but he was a beatable fighter as well. A lot of people try to gauge a selective prime to enhance his consistency like they do with Tyson imo. That's not to detract from him, i rate him top 4 or 3 at the weight.

Please carry on though.

 

Well I agree that taking the fight to Jones would'nt be in Archie's best interest, I'm telling you Archie would fight this on the outside using feints and the jab and Jones would a have trouble landing shots on Moore he is brilliant at making guys miss and Archie would'nt be interested on landing combination's in this fight, his main interest would be to draw Jones in in order land that great overhand right of his,

I think your taking to much into Jone's speed and combination's, he could be made to miss and look ordinary against solid ring craft ( McCallum and Griffin I )

 

You make a good point. I keep it in reserve though that Jones can beat him. Though that doesn;t mean i'm conclusive in picking him here, i said from the get go that Moore can stop him, there's no doubt in my mind.

I just want to make an observation on the point of effectiveness. Whilst McCallum was able to make Jones miss, Jones still ran away with the fight, and even in the more severe scenario against Griffin, Jones still got to him ultimately (albeit getting dq'd). I accept that Moore is far better than Griffin or a past prime McCallum, but i always tend to try and be objective in terms of what is/was effective. I do THINK that Jones could stop him, but i won't go for that because Jones never stopped a fighter of this caliber.

I want to pick Moore because i know he can stop Jones, but there's something holding me back. It's just that Moore was beaten by good opposition many a time, and Jones is good opposition at the end of the day. Moore was actually beaten by poor oppostion on multiple occasions, but i won;t heold that against him due to the dynamics of the boxing game at the time.

So do you have Moore by stoppage?

 

Yeah I think he frustrate Roy for 7 rounds by fighting on the backfoot similar tactics to Griffin 1 but executed even better, I think Moore is up 2 going into the 8th nothing major been landed but Moore's controling the fight, I feel he suckers Jones in to land his overhand right to drop Jones heavily Jones gets up but Moore goe's for the kill and finishes him the fight in the 8th.

by the way I've though about this fight for years, and I've always truely believed this is what would of happened, it's not just some prediction that I've just made up in the last minute.

what about you, your honest prediction

 

I respect your long standing opinion, i have a few like that myself, like Robinson stopping Hearns, i know what it's like when you don't want to be budged on an opinion you feel strongly about.

Okay, this is the way i truly feel about it. Of all the most high profile truly great light-heavies, i always felt that Moore is one of them that Jones is capable of beating. The reason i've took so long ****ing around here (sorry mate haha) is because i've also always felt strongly that if we consider them at their very best light-heavyweight selves, then Moore could/would prevail. You've probably gathered this by my lengthy posts.

Someone like Spinks or Charles, i pick them over Jones everytime, but this Moore bout is one i feel just torn about. Foster, even regardless of his power i give Jones a huge chance of beating him.

Anyway, i'm going to go with my heart on this one and pick Moore to stop him, say if this is a title fight, big stage, prime for prime (well at 175) then i reckon Moore would produce the stoppage. I'm not just saying that to agree, if you've read all my posts so far you'll get the jist of how i feel on this one.

So Moore to produce a right hand counter that signals the beginning of the end, MY ONLY PROVISO IS THAT THIS IS A TITLE FIGHT, then we got a deal!

I'll have to get my head down in a minute though mate. Just get back to me on this so i know you read my post.

 

Well first off agree that with you that Robinson would of stopped Hearns also,

yeah thats cool, I understand what your saying, so we both agree with a stoppage for Moore.

I know your going bed now but just give a name of one guy for the next match up or think of a good one tomorrow :good

 

Well i'm leaving Roy alone for a bit, he causes too much trouble, haha.

Let's see........ Chad Dawson

 

how about him against Hopkins

 

Yeah, might as well debate that one here tomorrow, seen as though it's not happening in real ilfe!

Alright then mate, i'm off, speak to you later.

 

Yeah thats why I mentioned it

anyway all the best, speak to you tomorrow :good

 

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Maybe when you were tucked in like this yourself you dreamt up Tyson's dominance and longevity!

Haha only kidding SQ

 

Hey Teeto looks like your online wanna continue the debate

 

Yeah son!!!

Well we can do this one as a kind of prediction for if it ever happens. The light-heavy Hopkins is the Hopkins we have, i don't think he's declined much since Tarver myself. I like Dawson, that's why it hasn;t happened imo. Better at the weight, a good technician, decent hand speed, good footwork. Hopkins would be his hardest fight by far and would try to offset everything he tries, Hopkins throws bunches of shots though and i think the question would be what would Dawson do if Hop does so without exposing himself to be hit in return?

You?