Was James Toney off-form or just outclassed vs Jones?

If, during both men's primes, they were to fight once a month for a year, Jones would win 12-0. His style was kryptonite for Toney,,,and this coming from a non-fan of Jones.

 

Just when you think your Frankenfranks posts cant get any worse. wallaa

 

Toney may have weighed in 167 against Williams but I imagine he fought at closer to 180 pounds. He was really a light heavyweight at that point. With his eating habits it's no surprise that he'd put on 20 to 30 pounds in between fights.

 

Toney and his camp making excuses equals fact now?

Jones footwork speed, handspeed and timing are a whole another level type thing. Toney never had fast feet to get near Jones and trying to counter punch or potshot such a faster man was stylistic suicide

 

Styles make fights, and Roy Jones was all wrong for Toney. Roy simply was much too fast. I think Roy would have beaten any version of Toney on that night.

But why was Roy so extremely dominant that Toney only had 2-3 little moments in the whole fight? Because Toney came down 40lbs in 4-5 weeks to weigh in at a 167lbs the day before the fight, and then on fight night Toney stepped into the ring weighing around 185lbs if I remember correctly. That's crazy, but it's true. It would have killed any boxer.
To be fair, Roy Jones entered the ring with an injured right hand and he too had trouble to make the 168lbs. It was a great, great performance by Roy Jones, and probably his best win. James also managed to land a couple big shots on Roys chin and Roy took them without even flinching.

One must give credit to Toney for coming forward the whole fight and taking his beating like a man. He tried to cut off the ring and engage Roy as often as possible. He kept trying. I remember seeing James sitting in his corner after round 4 or 5, after he got his ass whoopped badly, and his trainer Bill Miller looking dead serious - Toney yelled 'woooohoooo, boy I'm having fun in there!' - Bill Miller wasn't happy right there...

James Toney was also very weighdrained in his subsequent match against Montell Griffin, where he came down from over 200lbs to make the light-heavyweight limit and entered the ring at around 185lbs again. But this time James looked much better than he did against Roy Jones, and he did beat Montell Griffin in most peoples eyes (George Foreman called it a huge robbery, and the whole HBO team and most experts had Toney winning - even Harold Lederman, who doesn't usually give close fights to Toney). To be fair, it was a close fight, and Griffins awkward style gave Toney a lot of problems too.

 

Believe what I want instead of being overwhelmed by all the linked sources

Regardless Toney was usually a weight drainer, he did it to get size and strength advantages in the ring like most fighters do. Yet moans about it when hes drained? Do we really believe he trained and dieted harder for Barkley/Williams than Jones Jr? It was the same Toney that dominated that pair.

Don't let logic get in the way of your arguments though McGrain

 

As in Fox Mulder out there, or as in independent, non-biased first-hand sources out there?

 

My point exactly :good

 

toney was outclassed by the better fighter , for me

 

Didn't Toney put on over a stone before he went to bed just after the weigh-in, i.e. in just a couple of hours? That's what I heard.

Not that it would have made any difference of course.

 

Nonsense. Toney was weight drained in a lot of his fights because he's lazy, undisciplined and has an eating disorder. Not to get size and strength advantages (which he seldom had).

And yes, he dieted harder for the Jones fight than he did for the Barkley and Williams fights. I mean these are known facts, it's not even debatable.

And there's absolutely no logic in that, but it still is what it is.

And McGrain just stated some facts here - everybody knows Jackie Callen was pushing for a rematch with Jones at 168lbs. When Toney refused to go back to 168lbs (he was already over 200lbs again shortly after the first fight with Jones), Jackie Callen suggested that Toney should go on a talk show and talk about his eating disorder. He should do that to promote a rematch with Jones. At that Toney became enraged and showed up with a gun in Jackie Callens front garden, and he threatened her. This was even in the news.
Jackie Callen didn't press charges, they eventually reconciled and moved on to the Montell Griffin fight at LHW, but it was the beginning of the end of their relationship.

 

Toney against Jones was perhaps the MOST weight-drained man I have ever seen in a top-notch fight on PPV / Cable.......... WORD!

The only other guys to come close are perhaps Ritchie Sandoval in 1986 and Jimmy Garcia later in 1995......... Fact is, one vato was almost killed by Gaby Canizales and the other was killed by Gabe Ruelas........ However, both Sandoval and Garcia lost huge amounts of weight quickly before going into their title fight losses.......

RUNNER UP:

Roberto Duran looked drained and weak as hell in 1984 when he was smoked-out by Hearns in Vegas......

MR.BILL:deal