Who Has The Better Chin... Liston or Foreman?

At the outset of round three, Ali buckled Liston and drove him to the ropes with a near knockdown which presaged the knockdown in Lewiston. Foreman was counted out in Kinshasa, but it was a ten second count, somewhat faster than most full counts, and George still almost beat it. Ali himself has claimed that knockout punch to be the hardest single shot he ever delivered.

Foreman took it from Frazier 2X, Holyfield, Morrison, Briggs, Cooney, Stewart, Savarese, Grimsley and other respectable punchers frequently over the distance during his second career. Liston has two brief matches with Williams, and little else which truly tested his chin. Martin put him out like Weaver and Berbick did Tate, and Floyd did Ingo in regaining the title, in a way which even Patterson was never blacked out.

 

Nino Valdes? Mike Dejohn? Both huge punchers and big men. Both hit him with their sunday punches, and liston took them without blinking according to news reports. If your going to name the big hard punchers Foreman took punches from, the least you could do is do the same with Liston.

 

Foreman

 

Fair enough. Chuvalo did say an uppercut DeJohn buckled him with was the hardest single shot he took in his career, and it's somewhat surprising Mike doesn't get more mileage from this testimonial. (Footage of that punch should exist, as other clips of their match are circulating.) Still, Valdes (who only subjected Sonny to barely two rounds of punching) and DeJohn leave the more defensively skilled and straighter punching Liston very far short of the more open Foreman when it comes to consistent chin checking.

 

I agree. I think the film is quite conclusive about it being a legit KD. This is supported by reports from one of Liston's cornermen that he asked for the smelling salt after the fight.

As for Liston rolling around on the canvas, I'm not more convinced by that than anyone else.

 

For me, Foreman is the clear answer. Even if we only look at his first career.

1. Liston never shrugged off the best shots of a hard puncher like Frazier. I find it awe-inspiring how Foreman takes flush left hooks from Frazier without hardly blinking.

2. Yes, he was KO'd by Ali. But when we compare the films it actually looks like Ali's punches have more effect on Liston than they had on Foreman. Ali staggered Liston with his first clean right, he literallly landed 15-20 on Foreman before he took his first step back (in round 4). Foreman took easily as many more before he finally caved, when exhausted.

3. Yes, Lyle almost had him out, but I'd say that Lyle was about as dangerous puncher as Williams. Perhaps Williams was a bit more heavy handed, but there's not much in it.

4. Foreman was never smoked by some like Martin, nor in that manner. He was floored by Young, but this looked more like it was caused by him being off balance to me. He didn't look hurt at all and got up immediatly.

 

Foreman was a tank, but Liston could take a very good punch. Didn't Foreman compliment Liston on being the only one to take his best punches in sparring? Liston did say that Foreman had "murderous" power.

 

Both men had terrific chins ...

 

Foreman in his best days and nights excells in just about every department over my other guy Liston...........

Foreman is a solid top-10 ATG heavyweight, while Liston is closer to top-20 material..........

FOREMAN!

MR.BILL:deal

 

The little child part was pretty childish in itself pal.

 

Joe landed a big right hand that seemed to stun Jerry towards the end of their first go also.

 

Suzie, the consensus is with you but let me add a little salt to the mix. Early in my training I also was taught the anchor punch by an old timer and practiced it for hours at a time on a double end bag for years. I found that it so suprised those it landed on, and though it didn't look very hard - it was as it times the persons movement forward with your punch coming at them. Many times I wasn't expecting my opponents to drop or be so stunned but they were-such is a well timed anchor punch. To me the punch on film looks like one, sharp enough and unexpected enough to drop Sonny? Don't know, in one interview Sonny said he didn't see it and was stunned.

 

You better bar up your windows 'cos Suzie's about to come and put bricks through them...

 

That prolly ain't no ****, either........:good

MR.BILL