Jerry Quarry v the following..........

he wouldn't beat liston or foreman although its well known that big george was wary of quarry

 

Your right on

 

It is hard to say whether Foreman was reluctant to fight him or not and like you say, maybe trying to be a nice guy today. My opinion, I really don't think he was that much of a student of the game to tell you the truth, to know which style he might have a problem with. However, Dick Sadler was, and he avoided top fighters like the plague. He talked about fighting Quarry and Bonavena around '70 or '71 but that's all it was, talk. I don't know what it was with that guy, he really should have had Foreman stepping up before Frazier. Even after winning the title Sadler was taking no chances against no-hoper Joe Roman. Moreover, there were two more no hopers on that short list. Jose Urtain and Larry Middleton. I really pin the blame on Dick Sadler. He had a very crude, but powerful fighter coming out of the Olympics in '68 and he had the time to mold him and expose him to every style, but chose the clubfight circuit where all he learned was to bowl them over culminating in the Zaire disaster where he was exposed as knowing nothing about pace, setup, combination punching and having zero stamina if that man in front of him did not fall in the prescribed time. A Quarry or Bonavena would have taught him a lot in his early career, and if he would have lost, so what? He would have learned from it and have become a better fighter.

Scartissue

 

This is a post of gibberish! I did not say anything about Ken Norton, Lennox Lewis, Rocky Marciano or Mike Tyson ducking anyone. Please re-read my post. I thought I was very cordial to you. I made it very clear that it was not Foreman ducking anyone, but Dick Sadler steering clear of certain fighters. As for Foreman's stamina, this was no secret. Of course I emphasized by saying zero stamina, when I should have said poor stamina. Poor, because he never learned his craft coming up against the fighters who could take him into deep water. I was 17 when I attended the closed circuit telecast of Ali-Foreman. I spotted what Ali was doing by the 4th or 5th round. Was I that astute? No, the guy next to me spotted it too and the guy next to him. In fact, the only guy that didn't notice it evidently was Dick Sadler who had Foreman go out with the same plan round after round. After that, Foreman changed management and struck gold with Gil Clancy. He ran up a streak with Clancy having him work speed bag only. Clancy was turning him into a rounded fighter. But wait, Foreman didn't like this approach and brought in a sub-trainer who had Foreman working nothing but heavy bag once again. Clancy reports that day after day he ignores my instructions, his muscles get bigger and bigger pounding the bag and bingo, Foreman-Young becomes Foreman-Ali all over again. So don't talk about Foreman's "composure". He didn't have composure. And don't talk about Joe Roman being something he wasn't. I saw Roman lose to Robey Harris, and believe me, Harris was a bum.

Scartissue

 

I think they'd all probably beat him. The only one I'd give him a live shot with is Leon. Most of the rest were simply just a better class of fighter than Quarry.

 

Dude, I never said anything about Quick Tillis, an Ali-Foreman rematch, a Rahman-Lewis rematch or Louis and Schmeling. You're stating questions and answering them as if I wrote them. Please stop putting words in my mouth. You say I didn't criticise other fighter's stamina. That's because I was never asked the question. If you are asking the question, I will name some other fighters who had poor stamina. Earnie Shavers, Jumbo Cummings, Bernardo Mercado and Kallie Knoetze. That is a direct answer to a question I was never asked. As for Foreman's stamina and composure, which you say he had and I disagree, let's talk about the Jimmy Young fight. You stated if he jumped on him right away he would have taken him out. Why, because.......he had poor stamina? He had Young hurt in the 7th, why didn't he finish him off? Because he was exhausted and couldn't. Ali wrote the template to beat Foreman in '74, but it would only be a certain fighter that could utilize that template. It certainly wasn't going to be Pedro Agosto. Young was the closest thing out there to an Ali. Boxer, good jaw, elusive when hurt, good defense, good stamina. You think that punch that decked Foreman in the 12th would have decked him early? He was exhausted. So what did he learn between '74 and '77? Nothing! Same George. Arguably the hardest hitter in the history of the game, but no plan B when things don't go according to plan. What started all this is you saying that I said George ducked Quarry, which I did not. I think Foreman would have fought anyone put in front of him. But I still hold that Dick Sadler avoided certain fighters and Foreman could have been much more with proper tutelage.

Scartissue

 

A young Foreman apparently got a boxing lesson in a early sparring session with Jerry Quarry, one of the supposed reasons why he avoided Quarry.

 

I love quarry but I have come to belive those that are good enough to be a champion who got a chance at the title, and quarry got two chances, should have made it in their own time.

 

Rocky stops him in seven or right.
He crushes Leon
He decisions Michael.
He decisions Schmeling in a close one.
He loses to Liston.
Foreman I'm not sure ...

 

Dude, sorry if we got off on the wrong foot, but I can see now it's your style of writing. I checked out some of your posts on different threads and they are very similar. You have a confrontational style of writing. So, expect more people to fire back like I did when I believed I was being cornered. Regarding Foreman-Young, I wasn't shocked when Young won, I picked him. I'm not saying I'm a seer. Maybe I just liked Jimmy Young's style because I also picked him to beat Norton. But I knew he could handle a punch after the Lyle fights, had a tactical boxing brain and 15 rounds was nothing to him. I just thought he had the style.

Scartissue

 

Are you adressing me? Yes I am Round15.

Not making up anything Norton, and I don't recall in my post ever saying that Quarry and Foreman fought on a card for money did I? Pay attention please. All I said was that Quarry and Foreman sparred, and it apparently happened in late 1969. A very Green Foreman was knocked around the ring in this session with Quarry.

I don't need to learn anything from you, there's enough people in this forum who think they know this sport and attack others because their opinions are contrary.

 

Marciano...Win by SD.
Michael Spinks...Win by KO.
Leon Spinks...C'mon man...
Max Schmeling...Win by KO, RD 5.
Liston...Loss by TKO, RD 8ish.
Foreman...Loss by one-sided beat down.

Most people who visit this site know that I'm a huge Quarry fan and I love any and all thread involving him directly or indirectly.

Jerry Quarry is beloved by many as a contender's contender who would have and could have done wonders in almost any other era besides the 70's. Despite his lack of size or outstanding physical attributes, he had a very broad skill set and outstanding punch resistance. His best wins were against Mathis, Foster, Ron Lyle and Earnie Shavers(the latter two coming well past his prime) along with gutsy performances against Frazier(admittadly an ass whooping), Chuvalo(a fight he should have won) and Ellis(bad back going in to the fight). I rate him very high h2h when matched up against pre-1970 HWs but the size factor often plays a role in my analysis of any matchup involving heavyweights from 1980 to the present.

Of the matchups listed, the only guy that would be a one-sided is Foreman. He's simply too big, strong and too powerful for smaller boxer-punchers to be competitive.

People usually mention Quarry's struggles with Frazier when analyzing a matchup between him and The Rock but Frazier's punches were much cleaner and crisper than Marciano. In my opinion, Rocky's far too sloppy offensively and defensively for him to dominate Quarry as many people predict although I would have this matchup as a 50/50.

 

I agree that he would have been more than competitive with all of these guys. Michael Spinks just doesn't have the pedigree at HW for him to see the final bell against a prime Quarry who brings his A-game. Leon Spinks gets his ass kicked. A fight with Marciano would be very competitive either way but I can definitely see Jerry winning 3-4 of these out of 10 with crisp, sharp counter punching. Liston whoops Jerry 7-8 times out of 10 due to his overwhelming physical advantages... Same for Foreman.

 

Okay, but Prime Quarry is below 200 pounds? that means he sucks right?
By the way I doubt he would beat Liston. Liston too muscular and strong and that jab would cut up quarry quite easily. I got Liston TKO 6 by cuts.
Yeah, Quarry would stand up to him, but that wouldn't stop him from getting cut up by Liston's jab. Simple.