Did Andre Ward's cheating ruin Kessler?

Ward is just naturally better than kessler. Ward after only 10 pro fights would have still whipped kessler. Headbutting in ward's case is more of a dirty style than being straight up dirty. Let me explain...

If you look at how kessler fights (1-2 stalking) you should know the style to beat it. BHop used it on trinadad, tarver and pavlik who all fight like kessler and just recently jean pascal used it against Dawson (didn't think it could work on dawson but they were completely unready for it strategically). There are differences in some things that ward, bhop and recently pascal have done, but the main objective is to dart in making the upright stalker go backwards or become off balance. The style basically makes an opponent aware of the head as well as hands, giving more things to think about defensively. This gives the fighter an ultimatum which is either you back up and move or hold your ground and risk being headbutted.

So yeah the GAMEPLAN is somewhat dirty but it has been shown to be a big trouble to 1-2 stalkers so you have to go with that gameplan if you have the physical tools to do so against a 1-2 stalker. You see ward didn't do that to green because green isn't a 1-2 stalker. He won't do it to dirrell either because dirrell has too much footspeed and will pull the trigger on a straight left when ward attempts to. Footspeed is the main factor which is why hopkins couldn't do it to calzaghe. So yeah it can be beat so I don't see it as very dirty. Alot of grey area with that but you got to understand why it's done. People don't just fight like that for no reason. They gameplan and do it because most fighters cant fight backwards and 1-2 stalkers are historically bad at it. Like I said before, It doesn't work on everyone though .

 

Im sick of the "clash of heads just happens" :nut smiling ****.

No - it happens in some fights because of styles and in other fights you can telle that it is a part of a game plan.

Remember Tyson - holyfield 1 and 2?

 

gosh when a poster is getting schooled off Michigan, you know it is time to leave the forum

 

Good post. You do have a point in the fact that Tarver, Pavlik, Trinidad, and Dawson don't fight going back.

 

Very good post!

:happy

Besides the first statement. Ward is no where near as talented as Kessler imho. What resume has Ward got?

 

Dawson is the exception in my book. Pascal lulled him to sleep by luring him to the ropes and springing on him with explosives combos. I think dawson wasn't ready for this at all and thought pascal would stalk him. Dawson fights well going backwards. Chad was holding his ground and being knocked off balance against pascal but in most of his fights he is fighting backwards. Dawson was good defensively against pascal but it's hard to be good on D when you are knocked off balance in full defense mode. Pascal missed most of his opening shots and got some in when dawson became off balance.

Basically it was a beautiful gameplan that used the crowd as well as fustrated dawson enough to keep him out of a rhythm.

 

All you need is eyes for talent. Resume doesn't do it too much justice in the case of the S6 guys as well as Bute. You can just see what they do and what they can't do and there is far more that kessler can't do then ward can't do.

Still after talent, all the other intangables come in like chin, heart, power etc..... . Add all this with talent and we have a good look at what makes these fighters special.

 

I school you countless times. I turned you into a babbling fool with the mere mention of dropping a scorecard for Froch vs Dirrell.

 

waaaaah!!!?

 

fixed

 

I don't remember him fighting back I'll rewatch him more but Pascal was frustrating Dawson and Chad was thinking more and throwing not enough. I thin of Dawson as a fighter that has good footwork, is good at getting in and out, and likes to fight at a calm pace. I don't remember him jabbing and going back much but like I said, I'll rewatch him more. It's been awhile since I've seen some Chad anyways.(With Pascal/Dawson being the exception. I'll rewatch it for the first time tomorrow)

 

Holyfield is the godfather of the style LOL. It is easy to understand why tyson bit him. It's just a messed up thing because that is the only style to beat someone for that specific fighter. I would hate to have to deal with it if I was that type of fighter. Tyson, like the guys I named above had no back up plan for it and that is the reason why they were handled in that manner.

 

Maybe you should rewatch the Dawson fight, he did find the answer in the 11th round. Pascal Dawson was a competetive fight, Kessler Ward was a domination.

 

And a reason why boxing is loosing to mma etc. My point excactly.

 

You're on fire in this thread I couldn't agree more with this statement.