Muhammad Ali vs Jerry Quarry I

I don't think it even matters. I'm not sure if Ali-Folley is the best Ali performance, but I think many can call it Ali at his best in terms of confidence, skills, sharpness, etc. I know Dundee did...

Just look at the mindset of the two fights. Ali is playing with Folley and having a sparring session. Ali is dead serious against Quarry trying to show he hasn't lost a step.

If you don't like the Folley fight you can compare Williams-Folley to Quarry-Bonavena. It's a light and day difference my man.

You're right, though. I remember Ali getting hit some times playing around too much. But he's in complete and utter control. He doesn't look as smooth, as graceful, as aesthetically pleasing... he can't control with effortless efficiency against Quarry like he does against Folley. I do think Ali looks pretty remarkable considering how much time he had off and his style, in that context.

In one fight Ali's all business and in the other he is liking to entertain, show-off, give the people their money in a show. I'm sure he could take Folley out 5 rounds earlier if he really wants...

 

Quarry was more of a counter puncher but he never had anything to counter against Ali.

There is an Eddie Futch quote about the Ali-Norton fights (and what Norton did different from many of Ali's opponents) that may ring true here:

Ali made a mistake that he was able to get away with most of the time because of his great reflexes. But it was very dangerous. The classic style is when you jab you carry your right hand high to parry the other fellow’s jab or straight right hand. Ali carried his right hand out to the side because he knew he could get away with it. Ali had that quick left hand that was more of a flick than a good jab. But it was so fast. If you tried to slip his jab and counterpunch he was gone. If you tried to pull away and counterpunch he was gone. If you tried to bob underneath he was gone. What ever you did he was just too quick.

As soon as Norton started training to fight Ali in the San Diego arena, I thought about what had happened in their one round workout in the Hoover Street Gym. I told him, “You’re not going to hit Ali by slipping or pulling back or dropping underneath or parrying. You have to hit him when he’s punching. When he starts to jab, you punch with him. Keep your right hand high. His jab will pop into the middle of your glove and then your jab will come right down the pipe into the middle of his face. Every time he starts to punch, don’t pull back go forward toward him.” That’s what Norton did. That’s what destroyed Ali’s rhythm.


Quarry's best chance would have been to try and drag Ali into a war, but he was never one to do that. If you wanted a war with him, you would get a war with him and if you wanted a boxing match with him, you would get a boxing match with him. Quarry that is.

 

Quarry's better than Folley. They're both counter-punchers, and both savvy enough in knowing how to exploit and counter. Who knows how the fight turns out if Quarry weren't cut. Quarry is also much tougher and more durable than Folley, along already being a better boxer. If memory serves me right, Folley sat back and tried countering and jabbed a bit and let Ali lead while Quarry played aggressive against Ali which probably played easier into his hands considering Quarry isn't going to be able to lead effectively. He'd lose either way, but the fight would probably last longer if he played it safe.

 

I would say that Quarry was more suited to fight the more physical type while Folley did better with boxers.

 

What I can't really get my head around is that these tactics is rudimentary boxing. Block and counter. I use it just everytime I spar with someone with similar reach.

 

Well...

3rd round TKO

7th round TKO

Yeah, you could say he had more success against Quarry. If you think Ali looks just as great and sharp you'd be wrong. It's not even close. Ali was at his ultimate peak of powers against Folley. Even if you don't think it's his best performance, it's still in that realm. Certainly Terrel and Williams have an excellent case, even Liston I does as Chuvalo likes to think. But who here really says or think Ali was better or at his best of skills, sharpness, confidence, etc against Liston than he was against Folley? He didn't have nearly the same confidence, let alone experience. That would just be silly. That's the difference.

 

I think his straight punches was very good in the Quarry fight, but his hooks and uppercuts looked a bit sloppy. His movement was also good, but a tad slower and less smooth than before.

In the very next fight, against Bonavena, he certainly did look worse than he did against Folley etc. Up to the TKO I think it was perhaps his worst perfomance before Young.

 

Amen. I see you've been dissecting Basilio since that Mayweather thread? What a tough SOB... awe-inspiring to watch, huh?

 

Yeah, that was a very strange one.

 

Rudimentary boxing indeed, but in Futch's view there was nothing else that could be done against Ali than to punch with him. He also goes onto state other things about Norton's fights with Ali, such as his height and reach making a difference, which I left out.

Read it here:

http://www.badlefthook.com/2010/9/5/1671413/eddie-futch-on-ken-norton