Further to Sam's age, some list his birthdate as 1883, but he had a brother named Walter that was born in that year. Dates of siblings births were as follows: Charles (1879), William (who went by Walter) 1883, Robert (who went by Amos) 1888, Annie (1874), and Sophia (1877).
I was lazy, and quoted Boxrec, I have read that Langford plucked a DOB out of a hat and did not know when he was born ,Joe Woodman said the same . My point was that Langford was no "child", when he fought Johnson ,he may have been 20lbs below his optimum weight at 156lbs,but so was Johnson at 185lbs. I am happy to defer to your research ,and thanks for providing the info :good
I agree that he was certainly experienced enough at the time he fought Johnson, having already faced the likes of Joe Gans, Joe Walcott, Jack Blackburn and Joe Jeannette (twice), in addition to many other significant fighters. Although I think Johnson may well have beat him by decision had they fought again by the time Langford grew into a light-heavyweight, I think his chances would have been much better at that point. As Johnson himself said to the Australian promoter Hugh McIntosh when the latter tried to bring the two men together a second time, "I don't want to fight that little smoke. He's got a chance against anyone in the world. I'm the first black champion and I'm going to be the last." It's a shame he didn't get the chance.
He certainly deserved it and, though I would pick Jack, Sam would give him a very tough fight when both were prime .
There are several articles of Johnson getting offers of $30,000-50,000, even more to fight Langford, Jeanette and Mcvey. The venues on some of the offers were France, England, Great Brittan, and the USA. The bottom line is Johnson skirted the best talent out there for years as champion. The money and offers were certainly there for him. The first black lineal heavyweight champion used the color line more than anyone before or after him to avoid worthy challengers It is also ironic that the first all black lineal title fight between Jack Johnson and Jim " Battling " Johnson has an unsatisfactory fight, with a dubious draw ending. I get the feeling Langford could have taken Johnson before Willard.
Johnson himself was only 185lb when he fought Sam the first time. He grew into a large 205lb Man by the time he was champion. If Sam got thrown around and outclassed by a 185lb Johnson, I don't see how even a bigger sam does any better vs a bigger stronger 205lb Johnson.
Sam would not be a 156 pound fight with limited heavyweight experience from 1908-1915! Johnson did not always handle smaller fighters. He was Ko'd by Choynski, out boxed according to papers by a shade by O'Brien, and floored by Ketchel. Langford was bigger and stronger than all of them by the time Johnson was champion. Langford really was not small by the standard of the day. A better description was, he was rather compact. Check his tale of the tape numbers, and you will see.
Jack Johnson will not be the 185lb skinny kid he was in 1906, but the 205lb monster he grew into by 1910. Johnson will counter the lunging Langford all night long, and toss him around in close. Great matchup for Jack.
Langford was described as stronger than Johnson, and hit hit harder. Langford was a cleaver fighter too, with great stamina, offensive skills, and punch resistance. At 175-185, Langford was much better than the 156 pound guy who meet Johnson. Johnson best filmed fight was well below the 200 mark. After 1910, he weight hurt him as he was not always in tip top shape.
Johnson stated he was in the shape of his life when he beat Jeffries ,he scaled 208lbs, and handled Jeffries easily in the clinches, he was as strong as a bullock, I very much doubt Langford could have controlled Jeffries inside at any stage of either's career.Willard could not dominate even an old Johnson [37 ,2 years older than Jeffries was when he was man -handled by Jack].
Do not discount that Jeffries was old, shot, and tired. It is not hard to handle people in the clinches under such conditions especially in the July desert sun. As for who was moving who backwards, the films show Jeffries was doing the forward pushing for the most part, but he was too tired and slow to counter punch in the clinches. Jeffries was gassed out by round 12, and by round 14 could not keep his hands up.
"Jack Johnson will not be the 185lb skinny kid he was in 1906." Kid? He ws 28 years old in 1906. Did he pack on 20 pounds of muscle over the next four years?
The government and public wanted to cheat Johnson out of the title for winning it. If they just left it alone Johnson would have fought them all. McVey and Langford fought for the colored title in Australia
Jeffries was never in the fight, and Johnson manhandled him early on, books state the crowd fell silent when it was apparent that Jeffries could not match Johnson for strength .You talk about the" desert sun",and how Jeffries was ",old and tired,", yet refuse to make the same allowances for Johnson when he fought Willard ,Johnson was 2 years older than Jeffries was then ,and hadn't been in proper shape since the Jeffries fight, 5 years earlier. He was fighting in the heat of tropical Cuba ,and battling a giant, you say it wasn't hot that day in Havana ,the trained to the best shape of his life ,Willard said it was" hotter than hell,"and the fight went 26 rds, 11 more than the Jeffries butchery ,which Johnson could have finished appreciably earlier, added is, the fact that Johnson was in front after 20 rds ,with Willard. "I couldn't have licked him in a thousand years ,I could never have reached him" "Jack, better than I ever was" . Two direct quotes from Jeffries which headlined in papers the next day . The papers are replicated in Unforgiveable Blackness, the documentary. That's my Sunday morning , " shot across the bows", taken care of.:good