Archie Moore's views on the best fighters around/of all time

Again, I recently bought and am reading Archie Moore's auto biography and in it he mentions some of his favourites, or the best fighters he has seen.

Thought it was interesting reading, especially as Moore was a bit of a gym rat around the 40's and 50's so would have a good inside view.

When asked about his favourite fighters by fans Archie has this to say:

'I never saw Joe Gans, but from what I've read and heard I'd say my all time great was the Old Master.

'Joe Louis is the best Heavyweight I've seen in action. Book was published in 1960, so Ali was not around, does anyone know what Archie thought of Ali? John Henry Lewis was the best Light Heavyweight, but if anyone wants to dispute that and throw my name in, I'll listen to the discussion with rapt attention. The best Middleweight was Sugar Ray Robinson, the best Welterweight was Charlie Brady (is this a mistype? Should it read Burley?) Ike Williams is my pick for the best Lightweight; bantamweight, Harold Dade; and Flyweight Earl Perez.

'There are four more fighters I would like to mention. Two of them, Barney Ross and Fritzi (sp) Zivic, belong on anybody's list of greats. And at the top of my own list, the top, mind you, I put Henry Armstrong. My last favrouite is Sandy Saddler. I rate Sandy as one of the greatest punchers I ever saw, but if I had handled Sandy at the beginning I would have changed his style. I would have made him hard to hit by teaching him to use that fantastically long reach. They would never have hit him, and with his punch he would have become the greatest of them all.'

Interesting selection of fighters, I'm sure you will agree.

Firstly, i think it has a predominately black feel, which would have been slightly at odds with experts of the day IMO. But it also shows how highly regarded guys like John Henry Lewis was regarded.

Secondly, there is two names (three if you include Brady) that are almost unknown to me: Dade and Perez. (Although I have just did a quick search and can't find any fighter called Earl Perez so I will assume it is Pascual Perez. Ditto for Brady, I assume its Burley.) Well anyway Dade to me is a fighter that I often use as a 'mark against' Manuel Ortiz, but it seems he was a highly regarded fighter, anyone shed any info on him?

Thirdly, as soon as I read it, I just thought what a match up is Moore vs Lewis. How do you see it going? Lewis to me, actually reminds me a bit of Harold Johnson but with a bit more lateral movement and more fluid counter-punching style.

 

Also I missed out, what do you guys think on Moore's views on changing Saddler's style? It sounds disastrous to me.

Glad you liked it Teeto.

 

Thanks.

He probably would have ranked Ali number 1 then.

I have always though of Lewis as a bigger, better Juan Manuel Marquez. I would also favour Moore but I think Lewis's more dynamic countering could give him some added problems.

I think it is Pascual Perez and Charley Burley. I would say that he never really mentioned Burley in his book, or the other 'Murderer's' which I find very surprising. And to think if it is Charley Burley it is a bit disrespectful getting his name wrong. Either that or this guy has a secret admirer - http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=64008&cat=boxer

I reckon it was ghost written by a non-boxing writer and Moore did not check over it. Hence why Burley was misspelt.

Thanks for this.

How highly do you think of Ortiz's revenge win? Surely, even if Dade didn't join the Marines, Ortiz would still be the hard obstacle to overcome, do you think he could have toppled Ortiz earlier and reigned longer?

Also Dade was a West Coast fighter, I'm thinking Moore has some inside/gym knowledge of him.

 

Whenever you read about Moore, he is normally very complimentary to the Row. The Row isn't mentioned in the book, I think its been written to appeal to the mainstream, but it is still interesting.

 

That is the feeling I get from the bout, that Ortiz was under prepared and that Dade may have fought the fight of his life. I, although not many do, think that Ortiz looks superb on film, so I do think it would be hard to imagine Dade being better.

There is not really much on Dade at all really, is there?

That was my first impression was that Dade impressed Archie in the gyms.

 

Duodenum, I have the first edition GB version it appears.