Should vitali and wlad both be in the top 10 p4p?

wlad definitely. his longevity has earned it. plus he has defeated some top names since in his run. undefeated boxers such as peter, chagaev and ibragimov. plus top ranked fighters such as byrd and chambers. definitely earned it.

vitali. well im sorry but victories over fat peter, gomev, arreola, johnson, sosnowski and briggs dont cut it. he is dominant yes, but his opponents are ****.

and any arguments about people not fighting him is irrelevant, it dont constitute a ranking. same way liston wasnt considered champ until he finally got his shot at patterson.

 

So the people who think they should........who do you drop from the top 10?

 

hmmm what is my top 10 these days.

pac
floyd
martinez
williams
lopez
montiel
pongsaklek
pascal
wlad
jmm

now i put jmm at 10 because he does deserve a top 10 position based on his accomplishments. but i feel he is finished at the top now and will lose his upcoming fight.

 

no lets fill the top 10 with hypejob americans who have achieved **** all in the game.

 

Well Vitial gave an unmotivated Lennox a good fight. Then again Lennox lost when he was unmotivated so hard to judge. I do think Vitial would have given Lennox a decent fight no matter when they met.

Holyfield I believe in any era before the 90's and the birth of the super heavy would have been up their with the best. I would put him behind Ali, Louis and Holmes, on a par with Foreman, Tyson, Dempsey.

Ahead of Liston, Patterson, the big Finn, Burger, Lyle, Norton, Shavers, Witherspoon, Bruno, Abi Simmon, Sharkey, Baer, (might struggle with Turney skills), Rocky

Now Bowe and Lennox beat Holyfield and i think Vitial does too. Wladimir may have better skills but I think his chin lets him down. Also Vitial is a natural fighter, Wladimir has learnt to fight. Against the best I think Wladimir gets caught sooner or later. Not sure if the size advantage would be to much for Holyfield.

Most fighters prior to Ali could make the old 190 crusier limit (ring weight 195).
The 70's fighters would make the new cruiser limit 200 (ring weight 210+ with the day before weighin). Hell a young Tyson might have been able to make a guest appearance.

Good natural super heavies 235+ and not fat, I think there is only Lennox, Bowe and the two brothers. All the other big guys the grants of this world etc tend to be big rather than skilled. I think we have got to the point where there are enough super heavies to generate a few greats. A great 235 fighter beats a great 205 fighter.

Heavyweight skills have declined so it is very hard to gauge a lewis against a peak holmes or a joe louis.

 

Wlad, should be in the top 5.

 

Not for me. They are dominating a very weak division. is jabbing Rahman, Briggs, Peter into submission is not p4p material.

 

I say neither should be considered very highly p4p. They are both excellent heavyweights, but for a big man to be p4p, they need to be extremely skilled. Their size advantage plays an enormous part in their success, their skill set is based upon having a size advantage (wlad more so than vitali)...and that is the exact opposite of what p4p is. P4p is about factoring out the size advantage.

 

If they beat Haye and beat each other then ONLY ONE have a case to be on the P4P.

 

that is combining the two. treat them as seperate

 

Looking at the poor state of the p4p list, hell yeah...

 

Both will make it in time.


Peace

 

pound for pound supposed to mean if height and size are taken out of account. p4p unfortuntely wouldnt put them in top twenty. you imagime if mayweather, pac even likes of mosely would do to them guys if they were the same height?

 

People are making a mistake.

The purpose of the P4P ranking is that a fighter shouldn't be disadvantaged by their size. In other words, you can't be penalised for being too small or too big.

A strawweight may have extraordinary skill but not much power - that is due to their size. With P4P rankings this is taken into account. Someone like Wlad is as much hampered by his size as aided by it - however his skill makes him very effective.

Expecting a heavyweight to be able to move and throw combos like a welterweight is as ridiculous as asking the welterweight to punch as hard or to have the same punch resistance as a heavyweight.

Wlad should be quite firmly in the top ten. Vitali should be between around 15.

 

Definitively top10 p4p for both brothers. Not their fault that there's not any valuable heavyweight opponent for them.