Lose-Lose Situation?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by AnthonyW, Oct 28, 2010.


  1. AnthonyW

    AnthonyW ESB Official Gif Poster Full Member

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    Are boxers who agree to fight a boxer moving up a weight class in a lose-lose situation if they beat said boxer?

    The boxer moving up a division gets all the credit and plaudits if they win, and if they lose...said boxer is seemingly in a near enough win-win situation. They challenged themselves but were unsuccessful, credit is given because they took on a bigger guy...and they can go back down a division if they are capable of doing it.

    Whereas the bigger boxer, the more established guy in the higher division is given pretty much the opposite treatment. Picking on the smaller guy, only won because they were bigger, etc.

    Surely there has to be a middle ground...

    Examples of when this is not the case are welcome. :good
     
  2. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Loyal Member Full Member

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    Any of the 147 pounders (excluding Floyd) who manage to beat the smaller Pacquiao, would get all the praise they could dream of.

    But I do agree, more often than not, the bigger guy is in a lose-lose situation. A perfect example is Bernard Hopkins. Despite him being the heavy underdog against Pavlik and Trinidad, he was criticized for picking on the smaller man once he had beaten them.
     
  3. AnthonyW

    AnthonyW ESB Official Gif Poster Full Member

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    That's a good example actually.

    Definitely, like I said in my first post...there has to be some middle ground when analyzing these bouts. Like you pointed out, the bigger guy isn't always the favourite.
     
  4. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Loyal Member Full Member

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    I think there can be. It depends on the skillset and ability of the two fighters. If the bigger guy is evidently less talented than the smaller one, then yes, I think he would get the credit he deserves.

    But if he's bigger, more talented and is genuinely a better fighter than the smaller one, then I can understand why people will be less willing to give the praise he wants. Example - Mayweather vs JMM
     
  5. Who'sNext

    Who'sNext Active Member Full Member

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    why excluding floyd?
     
  6. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Loyal Member Full Member

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    Because he's the favourite and more talented than Manny.

    He deserves respect, yes of course. But I think him beating Manny, isn't as impressive as Manny beating him. Just like a Klitschko beating Haye, isn't as impressive as Haye beating a Klitschko.
     
  7. Who'sNext

    Who'sNext Active Member Full Member

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    well it's your own opinion, i don't really see floyd beating manny at this moment but it's only my opinion as well... and believe me, he will get massive credit for just taking this fight, not to mention winning it.
    ps so your comparing haye to pacman?? come on...
     
  8. AnthonyW

    AnthonyW ESB Official Gif Poster Full Member

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    :good

    Not everyone sees it this way though...a lot of people choose who the favourite is based on the size of the two boxers, and ignore the fact that the guy moving up a division could be a level or two above the bigger boxer.
    An example is the Margarito v Pacquiao bout...a good few people are expecting an upset because of Margarito's size alone. Pacquiao's advantages outweigh any advantage Margarito holds over him.

    If Margarito does somehow pull off the victory, that would be a great victory (whether he deserves to be sharing the ring with Pacquiao or not)...but no doubt people would be saying in the following days, 'Margarito should have won, he was the bigger guy'...etc. I'm not sure Margarito would get all the credit he deserves if he pulls off the victory.

    Also, the JMM V Mayweather bout...the only defense people can have of that bout is that Marquez wanted the bout with Mayweather...JMM wanted to chase Pacquiao, and a victory over Mayweather would no doubt secure him that. Other than that, it was a complete mismatch.
     
  9. AnthonyW

    AnthonyW ESB Official Gif Poster Full Member

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    Mayweather and Pacquiao would deserve all the credit in the world if they picked up a victory over the other one. In my opinion, it will be both boxers biggest win...however, neither boxer will get the credit they deserve from the opposing fans.
     
  10. cesare-borgia

    cesare-borgia Übermensch in fieri Full Member

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    How about a fighter being heavily critisized for cherry picking a smaller fighter, the win would mean nothing. But then the little guy destroys him and the bigger guy is known as shot and therefore the smaller boxer gets all the hate because he cherrypicked a shot big guy.
     
  11. AnthonyW

    AnthonyW ESB Official Gif Poster Full Member

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    That would have been exactly what would have happened if Pavlik beat Hopkins.
     
  12. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Loyal Member Full Member

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    Sorry, I wasn't too clear.

    I wasn't comparing Haye to Pacquiao directly. I was merely illustrating the fact that they're both in a fairly similar scenario in relation to this topic. Both guys are smaller and are considered by many to be the underdogs; therefore their wins would be that extra impressive.

    Also....

    ....really? For doing something he's required to do? I'll save the praises for when he actually beats him.
     
  13. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Loyal Member Full Member

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    I'm not sure, dude. If he beat an on-fire Pacquiao, I think people would be all over his nuts.
     
  14. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Loyal Member Full Member

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    And then they would also say that the smaller guy, despite having the lesser power at the negotiating table, implemented a rehydration clause against the bigger guy.
     
  15. AnthonyW

    AnthonyW ESB Official Gif Poster Full Member

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    If this was the Pacquiao that had just come off beating Cotto in an impressive performance, and not the Pacquiao who had to throw 1200 punches to try engage Clottey...plus all the media bull**** that Pacquiao is losing focus, isn't doing well, etc. Then yeah, Margarito would have pulled off the upset of the century in a good few peoples eyes.

    But having seen the threads and posts people have already started posting...some are already laying foundations for if Margarito pulls the victory off.