Damn Liston noobs. If they saw Glurg, the first Neanderthal bare-knuckle fighter, basically a more powerful, faster Liston, they wouldn't be so impressed. Glurg, totally schooled by Nog, yes? Simple maths.
walcott was 38 and 39 for his fights with rocky, louis was 37 and physically finished, moore was in his 40',s lastarza was barely 13st, charles was on the slide, layne wouldn't have been a contender in another era. i've got nothing against rocky.at 185lb he's a stanout, but he wouldn't live with liston
You know it's not as simple as a fighter that never lost. It's who he went undefeated against as your post partially admits ... that's why the questions remain out there ...
3 hall of famers ain't too shabby. 5 Number one contenders and one number two as your title defenses is nothing to hang your head about either.
When I watch the below matches - Vs Big Cat Cleve Williams I & II the things that come to mind as I watch are that Liston was human, he did go backwards and did get punched backwards at times and did go into his shell at times and did get shoved around - he did fight in a very one paced way most of the time and did shuffle along at a fairly sedate pace most of the time and didn't necersarily blow people away instantly with his big booming punches - he did sometimes need successive punches to get his finishes going - and did take his shot's back regular to probably due to the distance he usually boxed from - he did react to feints and back out at times, which shows that, like any fighter, he did feel pain and was wary of getting hit and in fight two Cleve had him wincing away in shock and a little shaken [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wWbpM99wD2M[/ame] [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pO6gqaQ5uC4&feature=related[/ame] when I watch Marciano below the things that always come to mind are that he doesn't rush in like a headless chicken and he's very hard to time - like Liston he is also equally happy to step back out and come around from a different angle when occassion requires it - he is not at all a straight ahead brawler - he is actually quite measured and and focused in his approach and never ever seems at all rushed or in the least bit worried about anything coming back the other way - and different to Liston he seems to be able to punch while moving his feet going forward - in contrast Liston seems to be very flat footed when he throws his jabs and seems a bit rooted to the spot at times whereas Marciano is constant motion and also very difficult to tag with anything meaningful - Marciano much more than Liston also throw's every punch with real deadly force - he must've been a really horrible guy to fight - Liston would at least give you pause time to think and couldn't keep up the kind of intense on you all the time pace the Rocky would set as the bout progressed and he had no problem whatsoever forcing someone back who outweighed him by getting on for 30lbs - no problem whatsoever - overall I see Liston finding The Rock just as difficult to fight as everyone else did once they got in there and he'd got warmed up - I see a late stoppage forced by Marciano or even Liston sitting it out again once he started getting tagged a bit too much more than he thought he ever would've [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVHNlm9MHPM[/ame] [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbl1ly8vyrE&feature=related[/ame] [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMBfW1rkc6U&feature=related[/ame]
Nice to use numbers without details ... first off it is four hall of famers ( Louis, Charles, Walcott and Moore) ... none were in their prime. Blah, blah, blah and so it goes ...