Jeffries v Byrd

Ali, Liston, Lewis, and Foreman's styles would translate poorly into a 20+ round fight. Ali and Lewis's footwork, taking 3+ steps for their opponents one doesn't go over well for extended periods of time which is exactly what happened to corbett. Maybe Ali would swell jeff's face but it'd be harder- he'd be punching down at someone out of a crouch with a leather-tough face from brine treatment. Liston and Foreman could bang Jeff out maybe. But Foreman never had the gas for even 15 round fights. Liston has a much better chance.

 

Well, I wasn´t talking about athleticism - a very overrated aspect of this sport IMO - but purely about speed. From what I´ve read he was pretty fast. My guess is he was slightly faster and more powerful with a single shot than Jeff. Both are incredible tough and have nearly endless stamina. This would be an endurance contest, and honestly, John L. is a bit more proven there.

Bob Fitzsimmons is one of the very few smaller man that I can see beating Rocky. I wouldn´t bet on it but I can envision it. Marciano could be dropped but he was never hurt. I stated quite often that getting dropped means nothing since there can be numerous reasons. Beeing hurt while not going down is IMO a more important sign for a bad chin than getting dropped without getting hurt.
But, I don´t think, a fight between them would last the 15. I think Rocky stops him before that. TKO or Jeff´s corner stepping in.

True. But Jeff only went further twice.

 

Jeffries was a punishing hitter. Every punch of him hurt. He wouldn´t lay you out with one punch but each punch of him takes something out of you. Like with Marciano after he sacrificed some power for workrate.
I´d rather get laid out by one punch of Foreman than getting broken down by Jeff or Marciano.

 

Athleticism matters, especially in a contest of two guys with similar styles, you know? Neither guy is a master-boxer or a really accomplished ring general so that factor becomes pretty important here. Agreed on the one-punch. I think it would have been interesting to see the real Sullivan. He isn't ranked worth a damn now, maybe things would be different?

Well bodhi, you know me at this point and I stick by the notion that Rocky's invincibility is hugely overstated. He had a great will to win, great power and stamina, and a solid beard. But he could be dropped, by smaller and older guys and I have to believe that part of some of those knockdowns involves being hurt. Every boxer can get hurt. At any time, by any boxer. Rocky is tough but he's not invincible and I DO Believe that plenty smaller men would give him a hell of a time, let alone bigger guys. I think guys like Conn, Loughran, Tunney, and a few others could outbox him and honestly I think Dempsey and Langford would ice him. How does rocky look against a big man that brings the fight to him? We have no reference.

 

Not here. Here it is durability and endurance and willpower.

Marciano wasn´t invincible. But I go by what we have evidence for. He said he was never hurt. I´ve never seen him hurt. So, for me his claim is true. There are plenty of smaller fighters who would give him hell. There are only few that would be able to beat him. And of the guys you mentioned I think only Tunney has a chance at beating him. A small one.
I can see Dempsey taking him out early. But that´s his only chance too. Langford needs to take him out or he get´s taken out. Langford´s chin isn´t the greatest and neither is his defence. Bit trouble for him. I think Marciano can take single punches from both. The question is if he can take combinations.

 

1. He maybe able to do those times, if you've ever actually done any running though you'd know you need to pace yourself and interval/fartlack type training can not be done at the same pace as your optimal running pace

2. 10mph is aprox a 27second 100m, is that supposed to be sprinting?

3. Doing 14miles in 2hours is do-able maybe although unlikely for such as top heavy man, doing it daily, no, for 1 he'd be too drained, for 2 it would wreck his joints.

4. Yes there is video of Corbett, very poor and he doesn't look nearly as fast as Byrd, who isn't that fast, he just looks faster and far better technically than Corbett

Even elite marathon runners rarely do this amount of miles, yet Jeffries does, but lets not forget his 14mile runs with a lamb on his back

 

1. I'm calling BS on this, for 1 you'd have a higher weekly milage than an elite marathon runner and at 215lbs you'd be putting extreme stress on your joints. But yes its just called 'conditioning'

2. 3miles will develop cardiovascular more than 10mile runs if take to the limit, and if you've actually run a 3mile as fast as you can and a 10mile as fast as you can you'd know a 3miler is far more taxing. 10miles are run much slower and yes develop muscular endurance. However boxing is stop start and is explosive, it isn't about constant slow movement that 10mile runs prepare you for. For Jeffries to claim 10mile runs are harder just because they are longer shows he knows nothing of what he talks. But this is the man thats supposed to go on 14mile runs carrying a baby calf on his back and according to Mendoza would have won the Olympics in both the high jump and 100metres

 

Greb

 

I have to tell you that there is nothing unusual about an ultra runner doing 60-80 miles in the course of a week.

You really don't have to be an elite runner to do it.

 

Just because Jeffries fought in longer fights does not mean he has more stamina than those men. He fought at a much slower pace, do you seriously think the likes of Ali/Holmes would have any problem with his 10punch a round pace? Saying Ali would have problems landing on Jeffries is pretty naive, given inferior past prime boxers had little problem

Its easy to have 'great stamina' and a 'great chin' against much smaller older past prime weaker it men. Jeffries deficencies in skill, defense would be shown up even more in a longer contest

 

Yes a 140lb 'ultra runner', not a 220lb muscle bound top heavy boxer, all that extra weight in adding 400seconds on top of a 140lbers mile time, 5600seconds on a 140lbers 14mile time

 

Which is part of what i'm saying when i mean that their styles would transfer poorly.

And anyway i didnt say Ali would have trouble landing, i'm saying he'd have trouble swelling. There's a difference.

 

Well no because they'd likely pace themselves for a longer bout. Its like going for a longer run, you slow your pace

Its worth noting all would have much more power with those smaller gloves. Ali would almost certainly cut Jeffries but the ref would not stop a fight so early in those days