Toney is techncially much sounder than the fighters in the 40's. In terms of defensive moves, Toney took what they had and then improved on it. His counter moves are more fluid and more elusive. If you can't see that, you don't understand boxing. I have a hard time envision anybody with Marciano's style wearing Toney down.At his best Marciano weighed around 185 pouns-190 pounds. So this would be against a Toney at his best at CRUISERWEIGHT.
Interesting. Toney was very good at age 35 and 217 pounds in 2003.. That version of Toney who stopped an aging but rugged 219 lb. Holyfield would give "The Rock" of 1952 fits... Too bad we don't have a time machine to check and see the true outcome... bbb MR.BILL:hat
really do you believe about anything about this computer fight? marciano was old ,fat and pathetic at this time. honestly ali could have humiliated and knocked out rocky in this sparring session. ali was compassionate
As for the first paragraph, it seems you are the one who lacks understanding of boxing, and its obvious you know vastly less than you think you do about fighters from the 40's. If you can't see Walcott as being at least as fluid countering and at least as elusive (better than Toney inmy opinion), you're beyond help. Walcott wasmore elusive because he not only could move his upper body, he mover his lower body! A very important addition to versatility in defense. As for the second paragraph, how can you not see Marciano's style as wearing Toney down? That's what he does; he tries to wear you down... Toney is a stationary conservative counterpuncher. Marciano is a volume pressure fighter. Marciano has a landslide advantage in conditioning. The style matchup favors Marciano. Go study some more films... and take off you modern-colored glasses when you do.
I really disagree with the first paragraph as I studied tapes of guys like Ezzard Charles, Walcott.Toney was better at standing in front of you, making you miss and making you pay with pin point accurate shots.Toney also has the edge in technique and was clearly more apt at fighting in the pocket.Toney learnt from these guys an then improved these aspects of their game. Now, of course, these guys mastered other aspects of the game that Toney never did. (e.g terms of feinting to set up a particluar punch using more lateral movement) Toney is a a counter puncher but certainly not a "conservative" counter puncher". In fact, stats prove that Toney is a very active fighter. This call really proves that you don't know Toney very well.In fact, volume pressure fighters are tailor made for James Toney (Jirov, Prince Williams, Barkleyetc....)This is when Toney is at his best because use angles in close to set up short accurate shots. I think you need to go back and study Toney's style. I suspect that you only watched Toney's last fights when he was out of shape as a heavyweight.
Show me. Sorry, when I look at the tapes I don´t see it. So, please, show me. Neither of those fighters was as busy, punched as hard, was as durable, nor did give a damn about what you did as Marciano. None of them could take away your defence by hurting your arms and shoulders like Marciano did. Comparing a Jirov to Marciano ....
Are you pitting the cruiserweight or super middle Toney against Marciano or that fat slob who masqueraded as a heavyweight? You're talking about Jirov, Williams and Barkley, not versus Peter or Holyfield. Furthermore, I think you need to remember that Jirov was quite effective in his fight with Toney, and that Jirov is, well, about 1/5th as good as Marciano. No fighter is going to counter potshot Marciano into defeat, no fighter.
:good Like someone already said, either you outmaneuver him or you outpunch him. And both is a hard task too.
Toney really likes guys who fight balls to the wall...he can slip right hands in his sleep and has an ATG chin. I think this would be really competitive and Toney would have a chance, it's not ridiculous to suggest he would win this. Not only is Rocco a good style match-up for James, he won't overwhelm him with size and won't test Toney's lazy feet. Lets put it this way, if there's an all time great heavyweight Toney could beat it'd be Rocky Marciano.