If Joe Calzaghe had lost a fight, would you still consider him an ATG?

I'm not sure what constitutes ATG, HOF or any of that subjective opinion based stuff but is Calzaghe not the Greatest SMW of All Time?

 

I consider myself knowledgeable and all those wins except rjj are good wins. eubank was at the end of his career but was not shot. joe was a good fighter.

 

Look The Ballbag - it was obvious you were just trying to be a keyboard warrior with the initial post, but you've just been hit by reasoned argument and now look like a bellend.

Very, very few "Euro-pee-ans" (very mature by the way.) have compared Calzaghe to Ali. I am a big Calzaghe fan and reckon him to be one of the most talented fighters of the modern era, but I stop short of calling him an ATG because the standard of opposition wasn't high enough. I will say that it wasn't his fault, he didn't duck anyone, he was just unfortunate with timing - not dissimilar from VK and WK whose reputations are suffering as a result of nobody else being in their leagues!

It depends how you define an ATG. For me it has to be someone who was the best of the best bunch. That's why Sugar Ray Leonard is an ATG and why Calzaghe isn't - he was the best no doubt, but of quite an ordinary chasing pack. Slightly controversial, but whoever ends up on top of this Super 6 pack (plus a victory against Bute to seal the deal) has a greater claim to be an ATG than Calzaghe.

Out of interest, would you consider RJJ an ATG? His talent was undeniable, but his resume isn't great.

 

he may be the greatest smw of all time but probably not for very long. it doesn't reflect well on him that the S6 happened right when he retired. those guys resumes are close to caught up with joe. if froch beat kessler you would have to say that their resumes would be on par. If froch goes on to win the S6 it will be hard to say he is not the best super middle

 

Cokey Joe is/was far from reaching all time great status. End thread.

 

Still consider?


Calzaghe is an ATG???? When the hell did this happen?

 

someones gonna be the greatest super cruiserweight of all time as soon as they invent the division

Joe hide out at 168

 

HOF @ 168lbs absolutely.
But ATG?

Maybe let that one soak in for a couple of years...

 

So thats a yes

 

Desperation.

Froch and Ward will almost certainly end there careers in higher regard than Calzaghe.

 

Calzaghe beats Froch in a head 2 head.

 

If he had lost a fight, he'd probably still be fighting today. Also, he would have been more eager to fight better opponents. I kinda wish he had lost...

A lot of it would depend on when the loss came and how he came back from it. If he lost one of his defences at 168 and then avenged the loss and still went on to unify, I'd say there's no problem there.

Anyway, he's not rated by many as an ATG for his record, at least I hope. Personally, I think he's a h2h nightmare for anybody near his weight in any era, which is why I like him so much.

 

Are you serious?

 

Agreed. But that's not necessarily the point. I do agree that Calzaghe is the greatest SMW.
However, RJJ when fighting at smw would have beat JC. It does not make RJJ more accomplished at smw.

Calzaghe is the best smw almost by default, he is one of the few quality fighters to seek out a legacy exclusively or primarily in that weight class.

Froch could surpass him (despite losing) by beating Ward, Kessler and Bute. Sprinkle in couple of ok victories and that could get the job done.

Ward could surpass him by beating Froch, Bute and 3 or 4 top challengers, as well as a few ok wins.

Nobody is likely to get to 46-0, nor do I hope they try. It most liely will have meant they had to go down the same road, which is racking mediocre wins.

 

No, because he's not an ATG even with an undefeated record.