Liston hitting the bag to Night Train

Check Sonny out in the movie 'MoonFire'

He beats up the members of a motorcyle gang.
And shares an ice cream cone with a little girl.
And drives a Mack Truck.

1970,,,,The first trucker movie.

 

L, Sonny Liston was much older than we thought. Much older.
Think, if Ali was Liston's age in 1964,probably 35-37 years old, and Sonny was Clay's age in 1964 [22 years old], what would be the result..?

 

I think Ali would have always beaten Liston regardless of their age, he just had his number.

Liston would have been a lot more competitive though no doubt.

 

Sonny was born in 1928,,,,,

There is a photo of him in 1933, at a St. Francis County, Arkansas
July 4th Community/Church picnic.

Clearly 5 or 6 years of age.

Would make him (just shy of) 36 in February 1964.

His only recent distance fight, versus Eddie Machen in 1960, at
age 32.

 

That would make him about 42 when Leotis Martin starched him.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYxoCwLiUbs[/ame]

 

Correct,,,,,,,,,,,,Kimosabi,,,,,,,,

Too many people claim Sonny Boy was in late-40's or close to 50.
No, just lived a hard life.

41 1/2 sounds very close to the Sonny who fought Leotis Martin.

 

If you could find that photo, i would be very grateful Duce. :good

 

Duce, this is why it is frustrating for me to read rankings of great fighters.The
uninformed poster never takes nuances such as age,of fighters who fought each other..For examples : Dempsey/Tunney,after 3 year Dempsey layoff.
Even : Schmeling[mid thirties]?Joe Louis 24,years old ,second fight ,1938...
Joe Louis,37/Marciano,28 years old in 1951...
Question::: How would the above bouts have turned out if the above ages
were reversed ? hmmmmm !
We must think of these things when we compare fighters abilities,I believe...

 

completely agree. the most annoying thing is when people say things like 'tunney just had dempsey's number', 'lewis just had tyson's number', and at some point in this thread someone has already said 'ali just had liston's number'.

a little context coupled with some creative thought wouldn't go amiss!

 

i remember reading listons training routine somewhere and being astonished at how easy it was.
it was like a three mile run in the morning, 15 minutes of skipping, 3 rounds on the heavy bag, 3 rounds on the speedball and six rounds of sparring when he was up for it or something very similar to that.
probly hard for the average man but very, very light for the heavy champ you would think.

 

Burt,

I agree completely,,,,,I never add to the Top 20 list or whatever.
Virtually impossible to rate fighters against each other from different
era's.

Add in age, conditioning, injuries, need to fight because of money or
politics, management, etc,,,,, all are components that are never added in.

Like you said, reverse roles. An aged Rocky Marciano versus a young Joe
Louis,,,,,,what would the results be like.

How would Sonny Liston be looked at, if he rightfully got a title shot in
late-1958.

 

Many heavyweights peak later in their careers, especially those stalled out by time in the joint. He fought in a very, very weak era. He was beaten by a beatable and green Clay, tho he was certainly getting on at that time. I like Sonny a lot, for his abilities and how he used his physical assets. However, hardly any heavies of the late 50's/early 60's impress me on film. And to hold the crown for all of one defense does not look good on the resume in terms of greatness. Still, I now put him on the cusp of top 10 all time for the division.

 

:-( I wouldnt say that..he used a very unusal but effective type of headmovent that was well corrdinated with his footwork.