Whether you love Pac or hate him - will ANYONE EVER do what he's done again (fw-lmw)?

If you watch the DLH and Hatton bouts, then watch the Cotto, or say the Clottey and Margarito bouts straight after (or even highlights of those 4 bouts). You will see that Pacquiao's hand speed has dipped slightly.

I'll have to rewatch the Cotto bout because I havn't seen it in a while, but if I remember rightly, Pacquiao looked to have been feeling the pace in the latter rounds...Cotto went on the run, and Pacquiao didn't chase. The same with the Margarito bout, Pacquiao was breathing fairly heavy after each round from the mid rounds onwards...and I wouldn't just attribute that to Margarito's body shots either.

If you are landing continually at will on your opponent, rather than missing the 3rd-4th shot in a combination...you are less likely to tire (which was why Marquez was Pacquiao's last great challenge).

And Pacquiao definitely fights more in bursts now, which is why I don't understand some people saying things like, "Pacquiao sat back on the ropes to let his opponent have a chance", or, "Pacquiao wanted to test his chin against said opponent to prove a point", or, "Pacquiao dropped his hands against Clottey to bring him out of his shell, if Pacquiao hadn't of done this, Clottey would not have landed on him at all". Pacquiao did all of these things against the likes of Cotto and Clottey, but only once or twice in a bout...the rest of the time, Pacquiao was having a break in the middle of the round, which was why Clottey had more success during the mid-latter rounds (Pacquiao would start off fast, have a rest, Clottey would land some shots, then Pacquiao would go all out again until the bell to secure the round).

Got to go now anyway.

 

Jomzky, if it was just the speed I would'nt be as adamant of my belief that Pacquiao's a PED user......

......its the reasons I described Pacquiao did vs Cotto a few posts above.

Pacquiao just about walked right through the bigger Cotto taking it up another gear right after an even heavy exchange had occured.

It is'nt about just speed, about just power, about just stamina......its the retainment in all those areas that lead to the suspicion.

You Pacquiao fans like to just focus and give a reason to dismiss why Pacquiao is retaining a certain physical skill, but dont evaluate why he's been able to retain so many of his physical skills when others before him could not.

The human body has its limits.
The human body can further those limits if his incorporates PED's correctly.

 

To your mind, all records are broken by cheaters. That is sad, man. How can you enjoy watching any sports if to your mind, all achievers are cheaters?

Fixed

On a more serious note, Athletes peak in different times of their lives. Until a boxer retires, you can't say that this is already the twilight of their careers. For all we know, this could be Pac's prime.

 

Every fighter will feel some fatigue PED's or not.....in a 12 round fight vs Cotto even though dominating, a PED'ed fighter is'nt going to be fresh as a daisy.

.......but Pac looked to me to have plenty left in that Cotto fight. What I saw was from Pacquiao in the late rounds was more frustration than fatigue, Cotto would'nt stand still for him.

Against a guy like Clottey that did'nt show up to fight, PED's or not, Pacquiao would have been crazy to just go Kamakazee on him........thats exactly what a fighter with a turtle shell defense would want you to do against him.

Pacquiao played it correctly and fought Clottey in bursts, but he did it because Clottey dictated that to him.

Had Clottey been more aggressive, Pacquiao would have been alot busier is he was against Margarito who was really using his mass to pressure Pacquiao.

As I was watching Margarito vs Pacquiao, I was thinking about what Gil Clancy a CBS boxing commentator once said about George Foreman......
"He just keeps coming and coming and with that big mass just applying that pressure, until he just devours you like a big wave."

More often than not the little man just physically caves under that wave of pressure.......and though Margarito had some brief moments where he hurt Pacquiao to the body (I think pretty badly) how the **** did that little bugger summons the energy to whiff wicked fast shots right back at Margarito?:huh


.....anyways, I got to go for a bit myself, damn I'm missing the Bulls vs Heat game right now.....

......thanks for being civil Anthony, most Pacquiao fans are not.:good

 

There is actually an answer to this. Most boxers still use the old school way of training; JMM drinks **** FFS! Whereas training methods and nutrition have improved multiple-folds in other sports, boxing's training methodology and nutrition (eating kangaroo meat and drinking **** come to mind) haven't changed much since the early days of boxing.

Pac's training methodology and nutrition are new school and scientific. He has a whole team (yup, not just Ariza) looking after his weight and making sure that he doesn't lose speed and power as he moves up in weight.

Bottom line, if other athletes can be helped by a more scientific approach to training, why can't it not help a special athlete like Pacquiao? To be honest, I think Pac's weight jumping won't be as spectacular when other athletes begin to embrace the new school way of training and nutrition.

 

Bullocks I've read your comments, its rare that a boxer or athlete peaks over the age of 30........can it happen, yeah I guess it could.......

.....because of its rarity, I would advise that athlete however not to turn down a notion for PED testing.
It just does'nt look good.
....and in the case of Manny Pacquiao and this.......

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZr6MZDBPZI&feature=player_embedded[/ame]

......it comes out looking as outright embarrasing.


You see, its just not about the feats I've described in this thread about Pacquiao.......you look at everything he's done past 130 lbs and combine it with the embarrasment of the failed interview, and it just gives out a fowl smell.

 

Well if this ever happens, then we can revisit this topic if we're still around by then.

I'd be the first to give Pacquiao his credit.

Most *******s dont believe it, but I like Pacquiao and not just the fighter. I like athletes who come across as humble on camera.
I dont like the boastful athlete.
......Pacquiao is certainly not one that boasts.

.......but I got to call them like I see them.
My respect for Pacquiao as a fighter went down the toilet with this whole PED controversy.:?

 

And their heads, it was bigger at the end.

 

This video is your not so secret weapon, isn't it :-D? Fair enough, he sounded dodgy here. However, there are innocent people who have been convicted of crimes because they failed to answer a question properly. People had been wrongly found guilty because they looked and sounded guilty even though they are not. Is this the case for Pacquiao, we won't know for sure. However, I would like to enjoin you to look at the other side of the coin. Look at the evidence being presented by the other side and forget that video for a while. If after doing so you are still not convinced that Pac is clean, then fair enough, hate on.

 

There are actual Pac fight pictures on the link listed below and they were taken at almost the same focal distance. Personally, I can't notice any signs of dome enlargement

http://www.theboxingtruth.com/forums/index.php?/topic/57-physical-evolution-of-manny-pacquiao/

 

Though I've never been one to attack and point to Pacquiao's dome, that was funny!

 

Fighters are not the same, their physical attributes varies genetically. Power, speed, stamina depends on the fighter. Does JMM punch equally as hard as Pacquaio? are they of the same speed? nope, right? they are completely different fighter! They train differently, they ate differently. Comparing Pac to other fighters who didn't succeed in higher weights is plain BS. You mean, when fighter A didn't succeed defeating bigger fighter B means Fighter C couldn't do it also against the same fighter? If that's your logic, then there won't be many multiple division champs, since it's impossible to win against bigger competition because others failed to do it, so you can't do it also. If you do otherwise and win, you must be on PEDS.

 

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:hey (age: 37)

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(age: 36)

 

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Yeah that's why Pac's not fighting at jr. Middleweight anymore. The 147 division is the highest he can get. At his age, That's the perfect division for him because he doesn't have to cut or gain weight. He can be in his natural weight throughout training.

The speed, power and stamina you're suspicious of can all be attributed to modern conditioning, training and discipline. And yes, he's not as fast as he was when he was in the lower divisions.

So really, if those are the reasons you think Pac is on PEDS, they are shallow.

Before you even mention that video you keep posting, that was during the 1st negotiations. In the 2nd negotiations, drug testing was ironed out.