Manny Pacquiaos So Called Improvements: Careful Matchmaking?

Thats a cracking vid aswell, nice to see the true facts all bunched together, especially the Morales/JMM stuff.

 

After he beats Shane and Berto, he will officially run out of opponents to fight.

What did you expect?

He would beat everyone on the planet and you'd still find idiots on the forum telling us

"OMG he's ducking....ah....ummm...hmmm...who's left...YEA....Rios !!" atsch

 

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If you are 37 years old beating fighters who should be calling you grandpa, you must be on PEDS.

 

what the!?

 

Actually Pac has improved after the 2nd JMM fight. The guy in the video is biased. He's just pretending to be objective about it.

He keeps highlighting the Marquez fight by showing what Marquez was doing to neutralize Pac. He, however, failed to mention the difference between what Pac was doing in the Marquez fight and what he was doing in the Cotto fight. It's obvious.

In the Marquez fight, Pac wasn't utilizing angles. He's just standing in front of Marquez while constantly doing head movement. When he attacks, he'll attack right in front of Marquez making it easy for Marquez to step back whenever Pac moves forward.

In the Cotto fight, Pac was still doing some head movement but he was going side to side and circling around Cotto while doing it. That way he was creating awkward angles from which he can attack Cotto at the right timing. His counterpunching also became a lot better.

The Pac that fought Marquez was still one dimensional even though he already has punching power in both hands at that time. He learned to use weird angles in his succeeding fights. The fact that Pac won the Marquez fight despite being one dimensional that time is impressive.

 

Ever since I've been watching him which was a couple of fights before the first MAB fight, Pacquiao's always been a tough nut to solve because he does attack from odd angles.

I dont know where you're getting that Pacquiao introduced this in the Cotto fight.
Thats always been Pac ever since I've watched him fight.

Now having said that, its not so easy consistently using the angles you talk about against Marquez who knows how to draw an aggresive fighter like Pacquiao in, as unlike Cotto, Marquez would hammer Pacquiao on the counter and turn to angle away from Pacquiao's money punch, the left hand.


You look at Marquez counter and then look at Cotto trying to do it, and we're talking about completely different level of counterpunching.

Cotto is more comfortable being the bully and not being the one pursued. The Margarito fight exposed that.


The least skill an opponent has, the more your own skills shine.
Now you not seeing Pacquiao consistently employ the same angles on Marquez that he did on Cotto and Margarito has to do with Marquez' skill level and knowing hot to nullify certain points of attack angles used by Pac.

 

No. In the Cotto fight when the bell rang Pac's direction of movement was immediately slowly going side ways. He attacks from odd angles and does it with timing.

In both the Barrera and Marquez fights, he wasn't even thinking of initiating going side ways. His direction was always going forward. Pac was always attacking from the front. Staying in front of them while using his speed and athleticism to overwhelm his opponents.

I was using the Cotto fight as an example but Pac started using angles in succeeding fights after JMM.

Regarding Cotto, watch the Mosley fight. He wasn't bullying Mosley around. he was timing and countering Mosley on the way to victory.

 

Name calling aside, without disrespecting anyone here.
Honestly, be true to yourself and look at the following rounds, one is a Cotto round and how he went about it early when he was in the fight vs Pacquiao......

.......and the other is an early round in the Marquez-Pacquiao rematch.

.......anyone that knows just little bit about styles will clearly see why Pacquiao cant find the angles he wants vs Marquez, and why they are there vs Cotto......


Cotto in that fight is either on the attack and when he's not, he's stationary right in front of Pacquiao.
Pacquiao can be anywhere he wants with those quick and fast feet of his vs a stationary fighter like Cotto.
Thus its why he seems to have found a new way to fight with angles as you describe.

Against a stationary fighter and one that is slow on his feet like Cotto, Paquiao has the choice, he can either go right or left, depending on the opening.
.....and watch when Pacquiao comes to attack Cotto....Cotto just dips and looks to fight back.


Now see the difference with Marquez.
Marquez is always backstepping and moving to his left away from Pacquiao's laser power left......

Unlike Cotto, Marquez looks to counter when Pacquiao first opens himself up for the counter.

Marquez is eliminating Pacquiao's choice to angle to his left and attack from that side.
Since Marquez is angling to his left, Pacquiao wants to force Marquez to move to the the other side and he can do that by landing the jab or the right hook and force Marquez to go the other way.

........but its not working for Pacquiao. Look at those rounds and look at the difference in defense between Cotto and Marquez.
Cotto is just looking to dip, but his legs dont move him out the way.
Marquez not only uses his legs to manuever away, but look, and this is key, look at Marquez play defense with his gloves and pick Pacquiao's jab at the pass.
Marquez not only picks Paquiao's punches with his gloves, he simutaneously is moving away from the punch as he picks it off.
The reason to move as you pick off the punch is in case Marquez fails to block a shot, he's moving away from it, thus if it lands the impact is'nt as great.
Cotto on the other hand does'nt do anything with his gloves to pick or deflect shots.


Jesus Christ, the class and the know how between Marquez and Cotto is like the difference between night and day.


I repeat, Marquez is nullifying and not allowing Pacquiao the choice to which angle he wants to attack from and he's doing it by parrying Pacquiao's shots and moving away and lateraling to the left and turning Pacquiao everytime Pacquiao comes at him with the punches.

Pacquiao's combinations flowed vs Cotto because he was there almost stationary.
......it was'nt vs Marquez because Marquez was'nt stationary, it was Marquez who dictated the terms....rhythm, tempo, and pace.

Watch these couple of rounds, they are an education!:yep

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlLO29K3fZQ[/ame]


[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIG-5xKJ0M4[/ame]

 

after watching some guy named Broner dispatch rather easily a southpaw.

Pac has fought Diaz, ODLH, Cotto, Margarito and Clottey.

He hasn't fought anybody remotely close who's big and as technically skilled as Broner.

I

 

Divac, I can't believe you don't see the difference between how Pac fights in those 2 rounds. I watched both fights multiple times, but let's just use the videos you posted.

It's easy for Marquez to step back and go to whatever direction he likes because Pac is always going forward. Look at Pac's stance. He is always slowly going forward, moving his lead foot little by little forward to get to Marquez which made him very predictable.

In that Cotto video you have, around 0:38, there was a sequence where Pac attacked Cotto directly in front of him and Cotto stepped back easily to neutralize it.

When Cotto was knocked down, Pac timed it from an odd angle where even if you step back, you'd still get hit.

 

Your wasting your time, Cant wake someone pretending to be asleep.

He still thinks Pac only has a left ffs :yep

 

Cotto has always been a flawed fighter... and I picked Pacquiao to knock him out as well.

People get too caught up on hype, that is a fact. Cotto is a one handed fighter, has slow foot speed/lateral movement, and has a suspect chin with leaky defensive skills. His stamina is also questionable as he fades in the later rounds. Exciting fighter, likable, but still flawed. Just because everybody likes you, doesn't mean you're a great fighter.

I said he'd KO Cotto in 9.... And I would have been right except for the referee allowing him to get beat on for 2 more rounds as Cotto tried to survive.

Hatton was easy to pick as well. Not only was he KO'd by Mayweather, but he was totally roughed up by Juan Lazcano. Anybody with any sense was picking Pacquiao to not just win, but murder Hatton. Sorry, but a win over light hitting Malignaggi doesn't do it.

Both Clottey and Margarito were garbage fights and should have never been made. Clottey had 1 KO in his last 11 fights, and Margarito was coming off a suspension and a very mediocre performance. The fact the Margarito fight was for a piece of the 154 pound title is a joke and should never be taken seriously.

Other than DLH, Pacquiao has been the betting favorite in his fights, and sometimes by a large margin. People like to pretend he was the "underdog" in all these fights, which is not accurate.

 

Are you kidding me, Pac is always going foward vs Marquez????

Do you expect Pacquiao to fight on the backfoot vs a technical master?:nut

Do you expect Pacquiao to fight on the backfoot vs Mayweather???:rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

Rewatch that Marquez round again, he's on the backfoot but he also attacks and goes foward when Pacquiao laxes to reset.

When Marquez goes foward to attack Pacquiao, as soon as Pacquiao wants to respond on the counter, Marquez is already lateraling out and to his left.......that angling to the left by Marquez gives him room to fire his straight right which he was repeatedly landing on Pacquiao throughout the fight.

Even when Marquez in on the attack, as soon as Pacquiao lets his hands go to strike back, Marquez is always concious to move his feet and lateral away from Pacquiao's strikes.

Where Marquez uses his feet to manuever in the midst of the punches flying, Cotto is just being stationary and is only playing it to duck underneath the punches.

Even if Cotto makes Pacquiao miss with the first punch by ducking, that fact that he's not lateraling out leaves Cotto in position for Pacquiao to continue striking because he's still right there in front of him.


Look at all of Pacquiao's recent fights, DLH, Hatton, Cotto, Clottey, Margarito.......
......none of those fighters have the ability to lateral and strike with a counter, particularly with the right hand wish was the key for both Marquez and Morales in beating him.

Is clear to see that Pacquiao's recent opponents are all "in front of you stationary fighters."......the type of style that will make a fighter with Pacquiao's strenghths shine.


LOL at you refuting whats clear as day on video tape......
When Pacquiao attacks Cotto, Cotto's feet stay put, which is why Pacquiao can go on either side of Cotto, what you call Pacquiao's new found angles.

.....but when Pacquiao was attacking Marquez, Marquez' feet never stayed in the same spot, he was always moving his feet and lateraling mostly to his left away from Pacquiao's left hand.
By Marquez doing this, he's not giving Pacquiao the option to angle to either side of him, but instead Paquiao's only options are to chase after Marquez or remain stationary himself and invite Marquez to come back at him.
Pacquiao tried both ways and both ways he got countered silly by Marquez.


Some of you Pacquiao's fans were criticizing Marquez for crying about the decision in the weeks after the fight for not finishing Pacquiao.
The Pacquiao fans were saying, when he'd stun Pacquiao, he did'nt go for the finish.:rofl

......going for the finish is exactly what Marquez attempted to do in that 3rd round vs Pacquiao and found himself in the seat of his pants.
Thats exactly what Pacquiao wanted Marquez to do, but Marquez made the adjustment when he was knocked down that when he went after Pacquiao, he did'nt stick in the pocket waiting for the reciept.

Cotto however was'nt capable of making the adjustment because it was'nt in his arsenal to use his feet to lateral and counter.

If you use your feet to move from Pacquiao's strikes, you're not going to give Pacquiao the opportunity to use the angles you talk about.

I've sparred a little in my lifetime, and let me tell you a skilled fighter who moves his feet is hard to gain the angle to which you want to punch against.
.......but up against a stationary fighter, and I can pick how I want to angle in against.

Hey lab, try going into a gym to hit the "stationary" punching bag.......even if you've never boxed before, I'd bet you can angle toward it any which way you wish.:deal

Cotto is right in front of Pacquiao, Marquez is not, and you still want to refute that its Pacquiao who's the one that has made the adjustment and is now using angles better.:nut

 

No, go watch the first MAB fight, Pacquiao was using his right hand plenty even then, the difference in why he could use it vs MAB and not Marquez, is the reason I outlined a couple of posts ago.......

When Marquez lateraled away from Paquiao's left, Pacquiao has a good angle to use the right, but what Marquez does is use his left hand to parry and pickoff Pacquiao's right jab.
Pacquiao never got his fight hand going vs Marquez, the same right hand he had landed on Morales the two fight prior, and the reason for not getting it going vs Marquez is because Marquez was parrying it, he was blocking Pacquiao's right hand with his left:deal

 

You're overstating it Victor......to say that Pacquiao's recent opposition have comefoward stationary styles that would make a fighter with quick feet like Pacquiao shine, is one thing.......

.......but to say that these fighters are garbage I vehemently disagree with.

Cotto for example is a good enough skill fighter and he's strong as a bull, so even though Cotto's strenghths are not using his feet, he's got other strenghths that Pacquiao still merits credit for deciphering.