Duran of Montreal vs Leonard of the rematch

The choice of where and how to fight was never Leonard's to make. Simple as that.

 

this seems to be where the fundamental disagreement lies.

 

Well if you believe what Ray Leonard says then you have to believe he set it in his mind to fight Duran at his own fight.

 

Leonard did move about here and there when the **** was getting thick on the ropes, but he was bent on trading and getting a KO over the never before stopped Duran in 1980. Leonard didn't realize going in that Duran could take his power at 147. Leonard was sure he could stop Duran late in the fight. He was wrong...

MR.BILL:hat

 

well, it's an interesting point of view. i'll watch the fight again with this in mind some time.

 

I don't believe much of what Ray Leonard or any other fighter says. I just judge things on video evidence of the "in the ring" reality.

 

So then you acknowledge Duran was in perfect fighting shape for the rematch? That's what the footage would suggest. Duran tells a different story, of course.

 

I have fights # 1 & 3 on tape....:deal

I have scored fight # 1 for Duran by 7-5-3 over 15 rds... Duran edged Leonard by a point or two for sure.... Still, it was a close decision either way....

However, having said that, I feel had Leonard bypassed his notion to KO Duran after rd. 12, and simply elected to stick and move in ring center with boxing, he'd have held onto his title with a draw for sure....

Either way, a rematch was certain to occur.... Duran was a fool to just go on a party binge and balloon up close to 180 pounds before he began training again....

MR.BILL:hat

 

I admit, judging by pics, Duran did look in good shape in New Orleans...

BUT! Duran was 145 in Montreal and the full 147 in New Orleans.... Duran was at weight in fight # 1 for a solid week or two beforehand, while just tipping in at 147 the day before the rematch... Duran's conditioning was not as good for the rematch...
-(

MR.BILL:hat

 

But probably good enough to see out 15 rounds, especially on evidence of the 8 rounds that had already played out. The fight was relatively close, and Duran hadn't fought particularly badly. Not terribly, anyway. I never think to myself, "Duran looks horribly out of shape here" whenever I watched the footage, I just think Leonard's tactics made it hard for him to get any significant work done. That's how I saw it.

 

I agree. Which is why Duran losing to Ray in the rematch has nothing to do with the excuses of Duran.

 

Had Duran not gave up in Fight # 2, the end result prolly would've looked like the lousy 1989 rubber match in Vegas...
dead

MR.BILL:-((

 

You sound happy it ended like it did?

 

The footage doesn't suggest Duran fighting with the same intensity, speed, and aggression.


Another layer to the bull**** that gets spouted on this subject is that the people who invalidate this win by saying "Ray fought Duran's fight", are often the same people who attribute a great amount of ring IQ/versatility/intelligence to Ray Leonard.

This in itself makes no sense.

If SRL did have the option of whether to box or brawl in Montreal, then why didn't he switch to boxing once he realized he was clearly losing the fight by the mid-late round stage?

If SRL has a high ring IQ and high intelligence levels, he would have known he was behind. Therefore, if it would have been easy for him to start dancing and taunting etc, why didn't he do it? :huh

"Because Duran insulted his wife" etc will no doubt be the ridiculous answer.

So SRL knowingly and wilfully kept fighting a losing fight and therefore accepted defeat purely because of some petty grudge over something Duran had said in the pre-fight build-up?


If that's the case, it's not much better than saying 'No Mas' and bailing out. If SRL knew he was losing and knew he was fighting a doomed strategy, yet blindly kept going with it anyway, then logically he was accepting defeat and not trying to do anything to change that.

Either that, or the man had an appallingly low ring IQ, if he didn't realize he was losing clearly, and therefore thought he was winning that fight.

Which is it??? :deal

 

He thought he could stop Duran late, and actually did rally to make the fight close after twelve.

Pride, and an invigorated Duran got the best of him in Montreal. I think by the time his ring intelligence may have kicked it, he was too beaten, and too absorbed in a brawl to escape it. He would have needed his box and move gameplan to be in effect from the start.

We're all going to have to agree to disagree. I see the logic in what you are saying, but I also plainly see a flat footed Leonard, throwing BIG power shots in the first 4 rounds of the fight, neglecting his jab, and keeping his head stationary. I see with my own eyes the evidence of an over-aggressive, poor gameplan.

Doesn't change that Duran has a win over a peak Sugar Ray. I just think the Ray Leonard that he fought, what, months later, would have done a much better job.