which fighters were one win away from being the goat?

Marcianos first amateur fight

 

if ali had beat holmes then i think he really would have to be considered the goat

 

you are joking ...

 

He already has an argument. This would be 6 victories over 4 top 10 ATG HW's. That is unless you're Unforgiven/Janitor/beinstock/Boilermaker/SurfBat and have Sharkey, Ruhlin and Maher above all these 4.

 

Clever. He probably got more mileage out of the memory of the Henry Lester embarrassment before his home fans than any other ATG got out of any single amateur defeat. It was like Schwarzenegger getting beaten by Frank Zane in the 1968 Mr Universe competition. (Arnold wrote in his 1978 "Education of a Bodybuilder" autobiography that he went home and cried after this defeat for the only time in his athletic career, and vowed he'd never lose again.) By the time Bob Girard decisioned Marciano in the 1948 Massachusetts/Rhode Island Golden Gloves, he was on his way. (Girard: "Of course I knew Rocky was going to be a champion. Why do you think I was able to beat him? It was only because our match was scheduled for three rounds!")

 

No, you look beautiful in your humble honesty

 

"Humble" isn't a word I often associate with the Classic forum.

You think Ali has a legitimate shout at being considered the GOAT, P? I notice that a lot of people seem to think Louis has a better HW resume than The Greatest. Thoughts?

 

...And how about Joe Louis? Does he have a legitimate shout in your estimation? What's your top 10 list, McGrain.

 

I'm not going to pretend to know anything about Benny Leonard, Bob Fitzsimmons, Ezzard Charles, or Harry Greb, but thanks.

I've always been skeptical about ranking old timers from secondary sources like books, etc. Boxing is littered with hyperbole. I just don't think you can be assured that what you are reading about the likes of Harry Greb can always be true. I'll admit, I've seen what little footage exists of him training or shadow boxing and it's not at all impressive by today's standards. Not to me.

How do you go about putting these fighters in perspective? Do you watch footage of the fighters they have beaten and rank them that way?

 

He did qualify that on camera specifically with respect to the heavyweight division only, and even then expressed doubts that he'd be able to beat Marciano. Maybe sharing the ring with a few other heavyweight greats when they still possessed reasonable condition would have induced further reservations. (It can be startling to remember that Rocky was the same age for Woroner's staged bout in real life as Foreman was for his knockout of Moorer. Considering his bad back and nearly 15 years of retirement, getting himself into a semblance of shape was no small achievement.)