Cleveland Williams vs Ingemar Johansson

I think then it goes into the canon of fistic knowledge that Williams was in an entirely different and higher echelon than Ingo (just look look at the two!), and ranks 3rd all time below Ron Lyle and Jimmy Young.

 

Don´t be ridiculous. None of them ranks above Tua or Ibeabuchi. :bart

 

No I think this is much funnier.

I have heard a lot of stories told about this, one way I have heard it told is that Big cat climbed out of a dressing room window!

In the amatuer's you dont get paid so you fight for free. when you are a pro boxer its your job and your reputation is on the line. williams ran out of a payday!!!!

At least ingo turned up and can always blame the ref for his DQ.

ever hear the one about the pro boxer who didnt want to get paid?

yup, cleveland williams.atsch

 

He bothered liston? He didn't win one round in two fights and got knocked the **** out. Whitehurst did not know who he was for 20 minutes after the fight.

Whitehurst is better than you give him credit for. He was easily beating Archie Moore on points, before Moore scored a late knockout in the final round.

 

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Williams floored Richardson in the first round, then beat the **** out of him for 3 more rounds before richardson was DQed for excessive headbutting. Doesn't seem like Williams would be afraid of a fighter he easily beat the first time.

 

Well, Richardson was rough, and butted him. I've seen the news footage of the fight. Maybe Williams was scared of getting roughed up and butted again. Richardson was always a rough boy.
Lots of fighters get scared, even against fighters they figure to beat. As D'amato points out.

The fact is he ran out on the fight, saying "God told me not to fight". Sounds like fear to me.

I mean, Johansson got in the ring with Ed Sanders, backpedalled a bit and threw too few punches, fought a very negative fight, and you condemn him as a coward who was "shitting his pants".

Williams, on the other hand, point blank refuses to get in the ring with Richardson again, says God has warned him not to fight, ruins the whole promotion, wastes a trip to England. A professional fighter refuses to fight. When people start quoting God they are usually scared of something.
If Johansson pulled that stunt you'd be crowing about what a ***** he is. :deal

 

I knew a tough old fight fan who spat on the floor whenever williams name was mentioned, such was his disapointment of what happened. he said richardson intimidated williams with his fouling. They say richardson was suposed to be even beter on the street than he was in the ring. maybe the big cat senced this?

 

Richardson was a dirty fighter and probably a bit of a thug. I suspect he like a street fight and a bar brawl more than he like a boxing match. Queensbury rules were an inconvenience to him, for sure.
Him and his supporters were a recipe for a riot.

I'm not sure if Williams would have been bothered or impressed by any "street hard man" **** from Richardson. I suspect Williams was from a even tougher background.
I think he just succumbed to ordinary fear on fight night (that ALL decent fighters get), and probably Richardson's roughness in the ring was a factor.

 

Both hard murderous power and shaky chins ,,, I like Williams as he was faster starting and faster over all and he'd land first ... the speed makes the difference but it could easily go either way ...

 

Once again...Williams knocked Richardson down, and beat him up. Richardson fouled Williams because he had no chance of winning. Why should Williams fight a piece of **** dirty fighter like that again, when Richardson was bound to foul him again when Williams started laying the thunder on him.

 

So you are basing **** all on a guy who went down more often than Sunday hooker? Is the DQ really Williams great claim to fame? Is this the paltry **** you base an argument upon?

 

Nope. My basis is Cleveland Williams had a rare combination of Power and Speed few sluggers possessed. He also only lost decisively in his prime to one fighter...Sonny Liston.

 

Why not? Look at the damage that Marty Marshall and Ali did to Liston's face.

So what exactly did Bert Whitehurst do or have that Johansson didn't?

No, you brought it up as support for your claim that Liston would blow out Johansson quickly:

Did you also find it "hilarious" when Johansson looked similarly "disgraceful" in his fight with Machen?

 

No it isn't. Williams had as much a rep for avoiding other fighters as vice versa.

"Williams, 24, of Houston, is a bad actor, but he does have a noteworthy skill; he is a first-rate puncher with both hands, and, as a consequence, has knocked out 33 opponents in 40 fights while losing but twice. In the main, he has fought those whom he can hit and who are not good hitters (busted valises with names like Baby Booze and Graveyard Walters) and has avoided those who can take it and not quit; and, in fairness, he has been avoided, too; there is no advantage in taking on a Williams."
-Gilbert Rogan, Sports Illustrated, January 1959