Ariza: Altitude training is counterproductive

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by retriever, Apr 23, 2011.


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  1. retriever

    retriever Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Why Shane Mosley will lose this fight after the 5th round


    Most people think high altitude training is the way to train. They feel that by getting their endurance to the level they want in an environment that is producing less oxygen will make the body perform better when the body is introduced back to lower climates when the body is introduced back to higher amounts of oxygen for every breath they take.

    In high altitudes, the amount of oxygen in the blood is reduced because there’s less oxygen in the air. To compensate for reduction of oxygen in the air, the kidneys secrete more of a hormone called erythropoietin, which causes the body to create more red blood cells.

    However the increase in red blood cells comes at a cost – having too many blood cells makes the blood thicker and can make blood flow sluggish. This makes it harder for your heart to pump blood throughout the body, and can actually decrease the amount of oxygen getting to where it is needed.


    At very high altitudes (>5000m), weight loss is unavoidable because your body actually consumes your muscles in order to provide energy. There is even a risk that the body’s immune system will become weakened, leading to an increased risk of infections, and there may be adverse changes in the chemical make-up of the muscles. Additionally, the body cannot exercise as intensely at altitude. This results in reduced training intensity, which can reduce performance.

    Besides Shane Mosley loosing muscle tissue and his body becoming depleted Shane Mosley has the biggest set back of all. By the time Shane Mosley steps in the ring, his body will already have become accustomed to the lower altitude. Everything his body built in the area’s of endurance up in Big Bear mountain are now gone. The body has already adjusted back to it’s natural environment.
    It is not like Shane Mosley is sitting there with all this extra energy that he will be able to display for everyone in the ring.
    Shane’s body will automatically get used to the higher levels of oxygen that you breathe in the lower climates. Their will be no benefit to what Shane tried to accomplish. Shane Mosley will have achieved no advantage. All Shane Mosley did was sacrificed muscle, strength, and speed for no reason.

    The only reason I put this article out now is because it is too late for Shane to go backwards. He has damaged his body enough that those effects are non-reversible. (in the short time left to the fight on May 7th.)

    I remember watching Tito Ortiz years ago when he was at the top of his game, but then he changed his training to Big Bear. He thought it would help him, but Tito started gassing in the 2nd round. That was simply because he actually weakened himself during training and his opponent was able to over power him during the second round.

    Same thing will happen to Mosely. Shane has depleted himself. That is why you saw what you saw in the Mayweather fight. That is why you saw what you saw in the Sergio Mora Fight.

    On the other hand, my fighter Manny Pacquiao is training as hard as he possible can in the environment he will actually fight in. He is eating and building muscle everyday. He is getting faster, stronger, while Shane is getting weaker and weaker.

    This fight will not go the distance. I hardly ever predict fights. Freddie Roach is better at that then I am, but you will see many advantages for us in this fight, but the biggest one you will see will come in the fifth or sixth round and beyond; that is strength, endurance, speed, and power.

    Shane will not be able to handle this.
     
    retriever, Apr 23, 2011
    retriever, Apr 23, 2011
    #1
  2. igotJUIC3

    igotJUIC3 Boxing Junkie banned

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    actually would explain alot if its true.....but there has to be positives to it i would think. I'm sure somebody had to have at least told him about this or something because he wouldnt continue training there if this were completely true i would hope.
     
    igotJUIC3, Apr 23, 2011
    igotJUIC3, Apr 23, 2011
    #2
  3. compukiller

    compukiller Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I guess we'll find out for sure very shortly.
     
    compukiller, Apr 23, 2011
    compukiller, Apr 23, 2011
    #3
  4. konaman

    konaman Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Sounds like bull**** to me.
     
    konaman, Apr 23, 2011
    konaman, Apr 23, 2011
    #4
  5. PNoyFightFanUSN

    PNoyFightFanUSN Larry Don't Give a **** Full Member

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    Huh. interesting. JMM trains high up in Mexico, i wonder why he turns out fine?
     
    PNoyFightFanUSN, Apr 23, 2011
    PNoyFightFanUSN, Apr 23, 2011
    #5
  6. RightCross

    RightCross Grandmaster of Boxing Full Member

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    Seems logical the way it is presented.
     
    RightCross, Apr 23, 2011
    RightCross, Apr 23, 2011
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  7. PNoyFightFanUSN

    PNoyFightFanUSN Larry Don't Give a **** Full Member

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    So does this put any sort of dent in the "Hurr EPO more blood is good!" theory to anyone?
     
    PNoyFightFanUSN, Apr 23, 2011
    PNoyFightFanUSN, Apr 23, 2011
    #7
  8. haglerwon

    haglerwon Official GTMSBT Marquez Full Member

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    It isn't anywhere near that simple. There were good posts at sportscientists and the new scientist during the World Cup last year (over half the matches were at 5,000 feet), and it's a hell of a lot more complicated (a lot of 'free variables' and feedback in the mix) than Ariza's fisher price version.

    I suspect this more about psychological warfare than science.
     
    haglerwon, Apr 23, 2011
    haglerwon, Apr 23, 2011
    #8
  9. brassgod

    brassgod Active Member Full Member

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    Is there an actual medical research study on this? If so, please cite the journal and paper number. Otherwise, it's unproven bull****. :deal
     
    brassgod, Apr 23, 2011
    brassgod, Apr 23, 2011
    #9
  10. RJJFan

    RJJFan Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    One study i read was the athletes just live in higher altitudes to get the benefits and then train in lower altitudes to get more work out of those benefits.
     
    RJJFan, Apr 23, 2011
    RJJFan, Apr 23, 2011
    #10
  11. HENDO

    HENDO Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I read that the best method is to live high and train low. I do know that Colorado Springs though is one of the Olympic Training Facilities.
     
    HENDO, Apr 23, 2011
    HENDO, Apr 23, 2011
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  12. donizhere

    donizhere Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Marquez trains high altituted any others?
     
    donizhere, Apr 23, 2011
    donizhere, Apr 23, 2011
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  13. megavolt

    megavolt Constantly Shadowboxing Full Member

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    I've read up a little on altitude training and such, some theories uphold living low and training high, whereas others suggest living high and training low, which is similar in a way to what Pac does in my opinion when he lives in the PI and splits his training between Baguio and the Wild Card.

    During my first visit to the Philippines I found the air was noticeably thicker due to humidity, and it affected my stamina when I ran the track there. Over here the atmosphere is different due to the temperate climate.

    IIRC, some studies indicate that training low will produce a better effect as there is more oxygen to utilize and thus an athlete is able to produce his or her maximal output which is necessary for growth, while living high will help in the production of red blood cells, but the count will only stay at an inflated state for only a short while after changing environments.
     
    megavolt, Apr 23, 2011
    megavolt, Apr 23, 2011
    #13
  14. HENDO

    HENDO Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Morales did when he fought Maidana. He was at about 8,000 ft.
     
    HENDO, Apr 23, 2011
    HENDO, Apr 23, 2011
    #14
  15. Primenal

    Primenal Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Seems to make decent logic to mean. I think people who train are funny honestly. They think if I punch with these 25 pounds Dumb bells in my hands then my hands are going to be faster, if I train at high altitude I'll breathe easier, if I do more I'll make way more gains, if I do less I'll lose everything (I'll just workout 7 days a week with no rest, and imagine how healthy, and great I'll feel LOL). People are just lost, but you learn threw trial and error.
    Best way to train? The same way your going to fight. I used to do JKD and my instructor told us the best clothing to fight in...Are the clothes we wear when we walk down the street. Who the hell gets in a fight while in there robe? No, if your in the real world, wearing your cowboy boots with your tight jeans, or your lugz boots with your baggy jeans...Fighting may be a little different for you than when you moved around the bag in your karate robe.
    I say this because IMO the best way to train...Is train for your environment, and for what your going to do. Running is good for boxers (to a certain degree), but running is not more important than boxing itself...Not to a boxer! I'm sure Micheal Phelps didn't run 20 miles a day, and only swam .25 miles a day. Dude is a swimmer, and thus trained to compete at swimming.
    Not saying doing something besides boxing for a boxer is a bad...Just most of the time should be worried about boxing, and things that got to do with it. People put to much in to small things like altitude...How well did it work for JMM against Mayweather? How well did it work Mosley vs Mayweather? How well did Margarito do in his last fight wear he *looked* to be super ripped, and in the best shape of his life (did his abs win him the fight?). Quit worrying about small ****.
     
    Primenal, Apr 23, 2011
    Primenal, Apr 23, 2011
    #15
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