Top 30 All-time Greats: Hopkins grains grounds

i like a lot of that list but you're gonna get butchered for fitzsimmons placement

 

I disagree with many things on his list but I can´t see a problem with B-Hop ATG top 30....His resume wasn´t that bad, and his skills are superb....Many guys fought worse competition, Trinidad is a good win, his longevity is great.....P4p he is greater than Monzon now in my opinion.....And Monzon is a top 30....

 

agreed. monzon has to be watched to be appreciated but his resume, to me anyway, is lacking in top quality MIDDLEWEIGHTS. as great as griffith and napoles were, they were just too small (well, as least napoles was) and while briscoe and valdez were very, very good but just shy of greatness.

 

Yeah, in my opinion Monzon has a better MW resume.....But p4p Hopkins longevity and skills are impressive, because of that he surpassed Monzon in my opinion.....And not just Monzon....

 

for me, their resumes are both based on longevity, dominance and skill but not necessarily the quality of their opponents. briscoe and valdez individually are better than any single middleweight opponent hopkins beat but overall i put their reigns tightly together. like you, hopkins later age and higher weight success puts him above p4p

 

I agree...100%...And Benvenuti !!
Trinidad is a good, decent win, but not a great win for me....

 

benvenuti has always been tricky for me to place as he was a very good 154/160 pounder but i don't know where to rate him in either weight. benvenuti was likely badly faded (and all wrong) for the second monzon fight and given his love of broads and wine, his prime ended quickly

 

Who is the greatest MW in your opinion Jorodz ??

 

:thinktough question. i REALLY wanna say hagler, who i think was the "best" but in the end, greb has to be rated the greatest. his resume is virtually peerless and the number of hall of famers he beat is staggering. hagler is my favourite and h2h, i honestly think he could take anyone on his best night but greb and probably robinson have to be rated high.

what are your thoughts?

 

About Hagler, I agree again with you my man !:good

But the number 1 is Greb...definitely Greb for me...

 

true but moore lost to burley, burley lost to charles, patterson lost to maxim. great fighters lose and when compared to those opponents, it's a factor but overall one loss doesn't mean that much to me on it's own

 

I don´t think so....Hopkins was very very green at the time.....

Louis lost to Schmeling, there is no shame in that...