Elmer Ray: A top 30 heavyweight of all time

I think so. How about yourself?

 

Herb Goldman rated Elmer Ray # 17 on his all time list

 

Marciano Frazier, a poster here, once talked in lengths about his research on elmer ray. I quote him here below, this is the best info you can find on him.

 

Marciano Frazier wrote



Here is some relevant newspaper material with regards to the fear of Ray within his era:
"Elmer (Violent) Ray has the extraordinary distinction of being the only man Joe Louis wouldn't even meet in an exhibition. Louis boxed Dan Merritt of Cleveland instead, and stood watching as Ray, a crowding weaver and bobber with the speed of a swift middleweight, ironed out Claudio Villar, a Spaniard, in 29 seconds flat.”
"Arturo Godoy and Tami Mauriello rejected guarantees to square off with Ray at Madison square Garden, Lee Oma the Violent One's share of the swag in addition to his own. Joe Baksi and Lou Nova refused. Melio Bettina will have nothing to do with the Hastings Hammerer. Jimmy Bivins turned down the chance to march front and center with him in Los Angeles, where the terror recorded 19 knockouts in a row. The current Joe Walcott will have no truck with him in Baltimore... Currently he is drawing and at Miami's Negro ball yard, Dorsey Park, while putting the slug on such as Dan Merritt and Al Patterson, the latter a slatty character out of Pittsburgh. "It's better than wrestlingalligators and fighting nine guys at once," beams Violent Ray."
-The Coshocton Tribune, March 8, 1946

 

Marciano Frazier wrote

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Second, the 1946 Walcott fight:
This one was a razor-thin split decision for Ray. While this match was very close, from the accounts I've seen of it, there seems to be pretty widespread agreement that Ray did deserve the slim nod. According to Sid Roth, "the Violent One, whom they had kept out of lucrative Madison Square Garden for so long, had a clear winning edge." The New York Times account had it 6-4 for Ray, and every account I've come across has either indicated Ray had a slight edge or just called the match "close" or "closer-than-the-buttons-on-your-vest" or somesuch.

 

Marciano Frazier wrote



For starters, the first Turkey Thompson fight:
This was a No Contest, resulting from a low blow by Thompson that incapacitated Ray in round six of their match. Looking through accounts of the match, it seems that Ray was apparently creaming Thompson before the NC and that Thompson actually threw two hard, flagrant low blows, one in the second and one in the sixth, possibly to bail himself out of trouble. The Modesto Bee account, August 10th, 1943, reads, "Turkey Thompson still wore his crown today after a match with a tough Floridian named Elmer Ray, who punched his better known opponent around the ring for six rounds only to have Referee Lee Ramage atop the bout with no decision after Ray had been fouled twice," and according to the Fresno Bee Republican, "Ray had won all five rounds and was out in front in the sixth when he was hurt by a low blow and Ramage stopped the bout."

I don't know about you, but it sounds to me like Ray was pretty badly ripped off in this fight. Under many commissions, I would expect that to be a DQ win for him. The fact that the somewhat inexperienced Ray was pitching a shut-out over Thompson through five-and-a-half rounds is quite impressive. One of the main knocks on Ray legacy-wise is that he has a rather thin resume against top opponents; close wins over future champs Walcott and Charles, a blow-out over middle-tier contender Savold, and not too much after that. If you threw a dominant win over Turkey Thompson (which it seems he really should have) into the mix, then his resume really wouldn't look so terribly thin.

 

Marciano Frazier wrote

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And lastly, the first Ezzard Charles fight:
The boxrec page for this match has a somewhat misleading description, quoting the RING Magazine account, which says that Charles "apparently won handily," making the fight out to be a flagrant robbery. Having looked through several other accounts, I no longer believe this to be accurate. Opinions seem pretty evenly split as to who deserved this decision.
The United Press scorecard had it 5-4-1 for Ray, while the Associated Press card scored the match 5-4-1 for Charles. Here is the description from the Middlesboro Daily News account: "The gallery gods went into ranting hysterics last night when the burly negro who once wrestled alligators for a living smashed the myth which was Ezzard Charles. The boxing bigwigs, who had been grooming Charles for a fight with Joe Louis, laughed. Once more they had given Joe Louis, the heavyweight champion, an excuse to dodge the violent one. For from 10 rows back it looked like Charles all the way. He danced and jabbed and landed a lot on Ray's bobbing pate and Elmer's busy elbows. But inside 10 rows you could see the devastation wrought by Ray's jarring hooks, blasts which raised the sheaf of Ezzard's cheek. “No holding,” was the continual admonition of referee Eddie Joseph. But Ezzard, of the winged retreating feet, had to hold for his life, and in doing so he made of Elmer Ray a modern Sam Langford."
According to the Nevada State Journal, "Ezzard had clicked off 15 straight victories since he received his discharge from the army 18 months ago, including nine knockouts, but he was unable to overcome his heavier and more experienced opponent, and he was unable to score a single knock-down against rugged Ray, who kept marching in, bobbing and weaving and throwing hooks to body and head. Although Ray admits to 31, which would make him at least five years older than his opponent, it was Ray who finished stronger in the 10th round and thereby apparently wrapped up the bout by a close margin."[/QUOTE]