Should Sumbu Kalambay rank above James Toney?

Toney was a great middleweight who went on to campaign successfully at heavyweight.

This isn't really that close imo. Knocking out nunn and holyfield plus some great victories inbetween.

 

What of his years in the wilderness at light heavy?

 

And his years in the laboratory at heavy...

 

Im with you!! The Jirov win is very impressive as well.. I can't believe we are even debating this really Kalambay was a good Middleweight but he is not Toney not even close...

 

You make some good points, but I still have to give the nod to James..

 

Do one.

 

if not a Great fighter then can we atleast agree that he registered some good (big) wins at multiple weights..????

Because he clearly you know did!!

 

what?? :think

 

Of course I do, see my posts earlier on where I said just that.

But quality wins are quality wins regardless of weight jumping. Toneys weight jumping is pretty impressive, because he was a blob with natural talent (and as Scientist is pointing out, other, ahem, additives as well) but Kalambay faced some very formidable opponents and put on masterclasses in some of them. He was just as talented if not more talented than Toney (defense with the feet to match) and has a stellar number of impressive wins that don't need weight jumping to render them impressive.

Nunns victory over him was impressive no doubt, but that **** happens. It would've added to his resume even further if he'd had a good showing against Nunn no doubt, but I think most discerning 'analysts' can see that stoppage was out of character and not indicative of his career as a whole, which saw him take on some very, very talented middleweights.

When people go on about how defensively astute Floyd is I always think 'why doesn't Kalmbay get the same praise'? And he had a much more complete offensive game.

As I say, Kalambay would take the **** out of Toney IMO. His feet would be the big difference there. In terms of resume, it's 'what you like', for me, Sumbu beating McCallum at the peak of his powers is very impressive indeed.

So, best single win? McCallum>>Nunn for me.

 

Sumbu is better, no doubt aboot it. To confirm this I created a Kalambay on fight night champion last night and proceeded to dish out on a created middleweight James Toney a masterclass of a boxing lesson, dropping him twice in rounds 4 and 14 respectively of a near shutout in which I only lost three rounds of a 15 round bout on legend difficulty setting while boxing circles around him. So on that basis alone Kalambay should indeed rank above Toney I say.

:rasta

 

Don't rank fighters based on hypothetical matchups RB, but I'm in no position to judge you :rasta

 

Never mind me Fleaman, I`m drunk and hungover and just talking the ****, is that the expression them birts use? Either way, Kalambay by a country mile, his fuildity and mobility will see him box circles around Toney, much the same way I did last night e=yessir behind my rapier like jab woohoo.

:bbb

 

Fleaman, the old school 'layout', it's been a while old chum :good Also, boldtype :rofl Good try! :thumbsup

McGrain, you're a legendary drunk, don't encourage RB!

 

Even post-Nunn in the 2nd McCallum fight Sumbu showed his awesome ability. I can understand the fight being closer with even rounds (which I don't score) and some of the close rounds going McCallums way rather than Kalambays, but Sumbu regains his timing, movement and is so insistent with his jab that I felt he clearly won their 2nd meeting as well, putting on a clinic down the stretch.

Kalambay: 3, 4, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12

McCallum: 1, 2, 5, 6,

Kalambay 116-112-McCallum

But as I said above, I can understand anything closer. Kalambay is just so hard to hit as the fight goes on, although McCallum tries to make amends for the first fight with a faster start, his pressure in the middle rounds isn't enough to stop Kalambay taking them, and Sumbu is clearly superior in the championship rounds as well.

Robbery? Or am I missing some of McCallums better work? 3 and 4 were close rounds IIRC, so if you gave 'em to 'The Body Snatcher' it could feasibly be a draw. But not the scores that were collected that night IMO.