How much of a chance to you give Judah to beat Khan?

This is the issue with Khan, I like him as a fighter. The speed is dazzling but christ he's got so many flaws and what is worrying is I don't just see the kind of improvement that is needed to really be an elite fighter. I wonder if Roach has doubts as well? Amir has been in the Wildcard Gym 2 1/2 years or so and whilst his conditioning is infinitely better and he has required the most rudimentary of defenses, he can at times look truely awful. I don't know, the McCloskey debacle hasn't helped but then an fighter would look bad by an opponent who is only interested avoiding gettin hit and refusing to engage.......

Put it this way, we will get a much better fight with Zab but Khan had better follow Roach's gameplan because any lapses, at least in the first half of the fight, then Zab can put him to sleep.

If Khan beats Zab, does he surpass Froch's achievements?

 

I think Judah - at his best level - is the better fighter. More compact punches, and sets himself so that he can punch on the back and front foot, unike Khan who reaches like an amateur alot of the time. The problem is that Zab struggles to sustain his level and also in Khan he is fighting a rangier busy guy who will be able to take advantage of his lulls and impress the judges. So he might get frustrated and lose his composure late in the fight.

If Zab fights an intelligent fight, sets traps for Khan and doesn't go looking for him all night, I think he can win. He has the skillset to take advantage of Khan's flaws and expose the superficial nature of his whole boxing game.

 

I agree with most of that... but what's important is you're talking about Judah at his best level. Judah hasn't been at his best level for several years, and even then he was just front runner with issues with training and dedication.

People who think suddenly this older slower Judah is at his prime because he's got sweet pea in his corner are deluded. Judah hasnt looked impressive in years, and he's had more chances that most. He had a good KO against Mabuza but he didnt look that great until the KO. Having said that I still think this fight is interesting because of the attributes of both fighters.

The main question I would like to know is how Khan deals with a fighter who is skilled. People talk about Malignaggi being a slickster but I dont think he has that style at all. Judah does have a few good shots and if Khan is caught with ones he doesn't see, will he be able to take them? That's what makes this an interesting fight.

 

Hard to say. Achievements have to be balanced against failures and Froch has 1 close loss to a quality operator. Khan has been blown away by a C fighter.

 

I'd say he does if Froch loses to Ward, Khan will be unified.... forget the Presscott disaster. Okay, a totally different level but Pacquiao is considered the greater fighter than Mayweather despite losing to two very mediocre fighters.

Of course this may all be academic, Zab could wipe Khan out with the first shot that connects, especially if he abandons Roach's gameplan....

 

i dont know zabs always relied on speed and reflexes i think allot of his reflexes have deminished

 

You're right about the fact that you have to balance it out with losses but only to an extent though... Think about Pacquiao's losses to even worse opponents early on his career, the time of the loss in their respected careers has to pay a big part in it too. Froch lost when he was in his Prime at 32 (that's the best Froch is ever going to be)... Khan in reality was a baby at 21.

If Khan wins then he has to be ranked 2nd at the least and a very good shout for 1st in his division.

Wheras Froch's ranking at the moment is not in the top 2; when you consider the Kessler factor plus Bute has a good argument to be there.

And considering both divisions are probably equally as tough that's why Khan would edge it... Also if performances count (which I think should) then Khan definitely should pass Froch's achievements.

 

and attributes have to be taken into account.

Khan has amazing handspeed, but that is it, he's vulnerable, and in his most challenging fight, had to get on his bike for the REAL PROVING GROUND that is the Championship rounds..

Froch is fairly versatile and has proven his style against better opposition, as well as going on a consistent run of good opponents. Khan has fought the likes of Salita and McCloskey FFS.

Your age thing means **** all as well. Fighters peak at different ages, and as for Khan, he's got less than three years left (at my most optimistic guess) being anywhere near a functioning athlete before many KO losses force him to quit.

He does not have a style that lends itself to a long career. He is an offensive fighter with shocking feet and a below average chin (at best) Name me any great fighters with these attributes?

Of course, Froch could go on to have the real *****s in his armour exploited many times and his allure could fade, his good run put into perspective (probably will) but as they stand now, Froch is clearly the better fighter.

He's all round superior technically in every way shape and form as well. CARL FROCH is technically better than him, man that's rough.

 

Top class post, especially the bit I've highlighted :thumbsup

 

is it just me but whenever I see a khan fight it looks like he just happend to be passing the arena and someone put some gloves on him and shoved him in the ring...its like he's never had any coachiing which is strange since he's been in boxing gyms for most of his life. Maybe because he could get by on his speed he's never bothered to learn the fundamentals. Having said that for someone with all his flaws hes done well to make it as far as he has in the boxing game and I hope he does well against judah.

 

Yep. You're right, he has done very well for someone with the technical flaws he displays.

What he hasn't got lacking is heart, athletic ability and fighting spirit. He has those qualities in abandunce and that can take you a long way.

I really hope Freddie can fix some of these flaws quickly. When you see a fighters hands going before his feet, the alarm bells should be ringing.

I think fighters like Khan and Berto are victims of boxing regressing in terms of trainers and other factors. There's just not the quality of trainers about today as yesteryear and that means we'll see more fighters coming through with serious flaws and more fighters relying on athleticism and not good fundamentals. Just look at the amount of great pressure fighters we had 30 years ago and the lack of great pressure fighters who understand the art of pressure fighting today. It's the same with all styles.

More fighters and trainers today focus more on becoming better athletes and not better fighters. This is what happened to Khan in the early days when he went to a rugby trainer. Who was building him as an athlete and it made his boxing suffer IMO.

Go to a local gym today and just see whats going on. You'll see guys building heavy things and doing all sorts of weird exercises that don't involve actually boxing. Just try and count the amount of guys that are actually shadow boxing infront of the mirror and you won't find many.

 

i have a question i want every1 to answer if judah took the full count and recovered from the Tyszu Kd how would u guys have seen the fight unvieling IMHO i think zab would have broke down mentally and would have been out of there by the 8th

 

He wouldve got sparked straight away, he was done

Although some people forget that he'd pulled himself into much better shape when it was actually stopped after he fell over and got up the 2nd time. Still, he was done.

 

Age doesn't matter; so a 21 year old froch would have gone on the run he has? Age shows potential.

Froch technically better? Dirrell, Kessler, Taylor and Johnson (before he realised he didn't have the stamina) were beating froch in that department.

As for getting on his bike, this is boxing, not see how times I can get hit on the chin.

I don't think Khan's footwork is all that bad and as for having quick hands and questionable chin; Roy Jones didn't do that badly.

I myself have very very quick hands and chances are a better chin that Khan and on your basis I could go on to achieve what Khan has gone on to do.

 

There's no way Zab makes it all the way to the 8th. As Flea says he was done. He's really never recovered from that humiliating stoppage tbh. It must've had a big mental effect on him.