Best Chin?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mcvey, Mar 26, 2008.

  1. Sonny's jab

    Sonny's jab Guest

    Fitzsimmons was knocking big or durable men out cold, like Tom Sharkey for example.
    The burly 220 pound Jeffries couldn't knock Sharkey out.
    But Jeffries can be classed as a "210+ pound puncher".

    If Jeffries had fought a clone of himself - and soaked up a load of power shots - I dont think that weighs heavier to credit his chin than him doing same against Fitzsimmons.

    It seems that Fitz had a top league HEAVYWEIGHT punch, regardless of his body weight. If we cant take that as a given fact handed down from the era then we cant take anything, and should perhaps remain skeptical to the point of professing no knowledge whatsoever of the era.

    I'm very skeptical of the pre-filmed era but even I would concede that it's about 99% likely that Fitz packed a powerful top level "HEAVYWEIGHT" punch. I'm "guessing" he had more KO power than Jeffries, and I'm "guessing" that Jeffries packed a decent heavyweight punch. Simple evidence, and simple testimony suggests something of that nature, I'm not exactly taking a huge leap of faith.

    Punching power isn't a subtle nuance or an elaborate claim on the "style" or "ability" of a fighter. Fitz knocked big tough guys out with single shots, guys who stood up well to far bigger fighters. He did it, therefore he's a banger. I dont see where the doubt arises.
     
  2. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    So what more modern day fighters would you compare his power to Sonny? Tyson, Bruno, Lewis, Shavers, Holmes, Ali, Klit, Bowe, Holyfield, Louis, Marciano etc.
     
  3. Vantage_West

    Vantage_West ヒップホップ·プロデューサー Full Member

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    McCall
    ? dunno
    Eubank
     
  4. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    As with most all time great punchers his power might not be anything totaly off the scale.

    Nobody to my knowledge ever said that Louis or Tyson was the hardest hitter they ever faced.

    An all time great puncher is 70% technique and 30% power for my money.
     
  5. ozziebattler

    ozziebattler Shadow Boxer Full Member

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    Oliver McCall.

    Even as he gotten older he still takes shots like no other.
     
  6. Sonny's jab

    Sonny's jab Guest

    I cant categorically compare him, I dont like comparing pre-filmed fighters against fighters I can assess properly on film.

    I assume (based on his reputation and his build) that he was a SHARPER "KO" puncher than some of those you mention above, some of the brute heavy-handed clubbers. But those guys could probably cause more distress with non-KO blows, that's the trade-off.

    His reputation for punching "power" was not surpassed by either Jim Jeffries or Jack Johnson, and I'd go along with that, (though perhaps Langford was considered by some his equal) and when Dempsey burst on the scene it was Fitzsimmons (Dempsey's idol) the writers often compared his punching ability to.

    I've seen Dempsey and Johnson on film, and I can say I think Dempsey compares favourably with Louis and Tyson as a puncher, and Johnson looks capable of hitting at least as hard as Ali or Holmes.
    So I reckon Fitzsimmons must be well in the midst of the pack you mention. I could try to be MORE specific but I havent even considered an order in which those names you mention would be listed as punchers. Fitzsimmons was a dangerous puncher, that's the bottom line.
     
  7. Sonny's jab

    Sonny's jab Guest

    It depends how you define "power".
    I think power includes technique. The power of a punch is ultimately measured by what it does to the man it lands upon.
    Powerful punches aren't always the "hardest" or "heaviest" blows, that's true.
     
  8. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    I would say that Joe Louis might have had less raw power in one punch than say Frank Bruno, but when it comes down to who was the more effective puncher its no contest in favour of Louis.

    Fitzsimmons might have had less raw power than Gerald McClelan or Jeff Lacey but he had something they didnt. The ability to deliver it the way it would do most damage. That is what sets guys like Langford, Dempsey, Louis, Tyson etc apart from the rank and file punchers.

    The best way to describe Fitzsimmons is as as Charley Burley in Gerald McCleland body.
     
  9. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    Over the past year, I have taken a serious long look at Joe Louis's career, and have come to the conclusion ( based on my own observations, and no one elses, ) that he was quite possibly the greatest puncher of all time. There were very few heavyweights who matched his actual power and virtually none who had his technical skills as a puncher.

    When we talk about chins, a name that deserves mention should probably be James Braddock. He was never previously Ko'd in some, 84 fights going in with Louis, and had survived Max Baer for 15 rounds. Despite returning after a two year abscence, Braddock managed to take a prime Louis's best for 8 rounds.

    In review,

    James Braddock was only stopped once in a total of 86 pro fights, to who I personally feel as the best puncher of all time, and managed to take his best for a long duration, when past his prime. I think Braddock's chin was extremely solid...
     
  10. bigjake

    bigjake Active Member Full Member

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    george chuvalo was a canadian heavyweight champion for many years
     
  11. Doppleganger

    Doppleganger Southside Slugger Full Member

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    Heavy - McCall for me - never been dropped or even staggered although certain fighters (Bruno/Lewis) did make him go into a shell.

    LHW - I have no idea.

    Middle - Hagler for me, his record of durability speaks for itself and how many middles in history could have taken that first big right from Tommy Hearns?
     
  12. Russell

    Russell Loyal Member Full Member

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    I never saw Lennox make McCall go into a shell.

    He was just pissing him off the second time. McCall put his ****ing hands down and was taunting Lennox to hit him again.
     
  13. Doppleganger

    Doppleganger Southside Slugger Full Member

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    Maybe the wrong choice of words there but McCall did quit. He wasn't, however, rocked or staggered by either Bruno, Lewis or anyone else AFAIK. I haven't seen the Seldon fight though.
     
  14. Russell

    Russell Loyal Member Full Member

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    I've seen it. He was never stunned.

    Seldon got his attention, but that was about it.
     
  15. Bigcat

    Bigcat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Oliver McCall (former world heavyweight champ , never stopped or knocked down or out in a long career)

    Gotta be considered at heavyweight.........