I watched an MMA vs Boxer and the boxer never got a punch off. Got his legs kicked out from under him. Try again.
I can see what you're saying but if you're worrying about getting taken down than MMA is not for you. There are obviously some differences but the bottom line is the skills learned in boxing, Muay Thai, Kickboxing are absolutely applicable to MMA. Its no secret that a K-1 level striker in Crocop walked right into MMA and became the most dynamic striker in the sport. Its no secret that former pro boxers Marcus Davis, Chris Lytle are considered dangerous on their feet. The fighter I sparred was an amatuer and he wasnt bad because his tools were limited. He was bad because he was just a terrible striker who had no idea what he was doing. Hands are an incredibly important tool in striking and if you cant use them effectively you're pretty much screwed.
MMA grew out of people wanting to test their abilities to see if they would work in a fight. So, yes, there are rules, and some folks ONLY train for the sport, other train for self defense.
Huh? I've seen this go in cycles. Bottom line, strikes are cumulative damage. A good fighter will use strikes to set up a submission.
Please dont bring up the Arthur Williams example. The boxers who have gotten their legs kicked out from under them probably had no business being in the ring. They were either completely washed up or werent very good, athletic to begin with. If wrestlers can pick up passable striking skills within 4-5 months (Koscheck) than im sure an elite professional boxer could as well. People severely overrate the striking ability of MMA fighters. Most of them cant even check a low kick. Some of the worst striking displays ive ever seen have come from MMA and some of them have been at the highest level of the sport. MMA striking is very predictable, simple, ordinary. When they arent throwing 1-2's, they are throwing sloppy low kicks. The striking is not dynamic, they dont throw from various angles, they dont throw combinations, they dont go to the body. The defense is also pretty damn atrocious as well. Dont get me wrong there a few solid boxers in MMA like BJ Penn, GSP, KJ Noons, Anderson Silva but for the most part the striking is just awful to watch.
Similar to boxing. Some train for the sport, some train for self defense. MMA got started to see which style of fighting was most effective in that context of fighting.
I just watched Valuev vs Ruiz. A world title fight? Nuf said? The elite in either sport are a pleasure to watch but there is a very big fall off once you go a little way down the ladder. Boxing is watered down with 17 divisions and 4 MAJOR sanctioning bodies. Want to count Ring and make it 5?
Well, if you want to train for self defense with boxing, you better pray your opponent knows the 'rules'. Of course, even boxers in the ring don't always follow them.
The point is that the cage is tailored to ground fighting. In PRIDE, Strikers were much more successful in the ring. Crocop, Hunt gave Fedor 2 very tough fights. Fedor has even gone on record saying Hunt, Crocop and Noguiera were his toughest fights. Hunt, Crocop are PURE strikers with absolutely no ground game whatsoever. All im saying is that MMA is not REAL fighting. Its a sport like boxing that has specific ways to win. Brock Lesnar, is an athletic wrestler with less than 2 years of experience in MMA and he just beat a guy whos been in the game for 10-15 years in Heath Herring. Herring is a top 10 heavyweight in the world. Brock won because he was the better wrestler. Thats it. He outwrestled him. The notion that to be good in MMA you have to be well-rounded in MMA is a myth. Sure, GSP, Penn, Fedor, Silva are well-rounded but guys like Hughes, Sylvia, Liddell, Sherk, Lesnar, Koscheck, Aoki, Shields are NOT well-rounded. An athletic great wrestler with admirable BJJ defense can go very far in MMA with Lay and Pray tactics. This kind of fighter can win a fight without even throwing a punch on their feet. If you're athletic like GSP or Kos you dont need to setup a takedown, you just go for it, and they always get it.
I didnt even watch Valuev/Ruiz. I hate the majority of heavyweights in boxing right now. LOL. In fact, I hate the majority of heavyweight fights in all sports whether it be K-1, MMA etc. Watching Tim Sylvia fight makes my eyes hurt. In MMA you have multiple organizations claiming to have the best fighters. Is it Dream? UFC? Affliction? EliteXC? King of the Cage? Bodog? The UFC is synomous with MMA. It is MMA. And yet 3 of the top 4 heavyweights in the world dont even fight in the UFC. Fedor, Couture, Sylvia, Arlovski, Barnett all fight in other organizations or are currently retired. If the P4P best boxer in the world (Mayweather) fought on PPV he'd get more than 500,000 buys. If he fought another notable name it'd get close to million if not more. And yet the best p4p fighter in MMA in Fedor fought a top 5 heavyweight in Tim Sylvia and the event only did 70-80,000 PPV buys. That is just an awful total considering the card was absolutely stacked with solid fighters. Arlovski, Belfort, Fedor, Sylvia, Lindland. Other organizations not named the UFC can barely survive. IFL went bankrupt, Affliction said they are doing 2 more shows and thats it. EliteXC is on the verge of bankruptcy. MMA also introduced additional weight classes and now they are operating a similar type class system as boxing. MMA is becoming just as fragmented as boxing if it hasnt already. I agree with you, the elite in both sports are enjoyable to watch. I love myself a Silva, GSP, Penn fight. As well as a Margarito, Cotto, Mayweather, Pacquaio fight as well. And obviously you will get some boring fights as well like Hopkins, Tim Sylvia, Koscheck. But thats just part of being a fan. There are good and bad football games, basketball games etc. It just goes with the territory. I dont see how boxing is any more watered down than MMA though. MMA has alot of low-tier talent occupying lower rank organizations that are just painful to watch. And I was watching Friday Night Fights this week and I actually enjoyed every single fight on the card. I enjoyed watching Remillard whos a 22 year old prospect, I enjoyed Godfrey/Nwodo 2 tough top 20 cruiserweights. FNF has been doing a great job this year.
Well im just saying, hand to hand combat is extremely practical in real life situations. Being able to avoid punches while throwing some of your own is extremely useful and can get you out of alot of situations. I can say the same thing about Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. I actually think striking is far more practical than any type of ground fighting in REAL life. BJJ, wrestling dont even deal with strikes. This is something that alot of BJJ, wrestlers have to deal with when going to MMA is the addition of strikes. Alberto Crane is world class in BJJ and has won medals at the BJJ mundials and yet he couldnt beat a high school wrestler in Roger Huerta. Not only did he lose but he got beat at his own game and his face was a bloody mess.
Well are you trying to say UFC/cage is MMA and Pride wasn't? But let's be honest. If you talk about a 'real fight' then the only way the guys stay at range and trade blows is by agreement. Most people don't have true on punch KO power so they guy eating the most punches is bound to rush the other guy and tie him up as a defensive tactic. It happens in boxing all the time and it is 'against the rules' there. And to be really honest, we have to define 'real fight'. Are we talking vicious? Like someone willing to gouge out an eyeball? A guy I knew in high school lost an eye in a knife fight. Take the knife out of this fight. Would you rather be trained in MMA or Boxing for this fight, given an opponent that would as soon KILL you as look at you?
I'm hoping this is the end of the Butterbeans of the world in boxing. I actually think its good for boxing because it will become less watered down. The elites in both sports will obviously be very good but MMA will have all the crappy fighters fighting in the lower orgs of MMA.