Greatest Underachiever Champion ...

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by he grant, Nov 6, 2011.

  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Dempsey more than Johnson you think?
     
  2. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    Yes.

    Johnson did at least beat every major player of his era at some point in their career.
     
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Probably, but I like Dempsey's title-years opposition better than Johnson's. Johnson facing the best between Burns and Willard...is a thought.
     
  4. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    Just a thought, but he met every lineal champion from Fitzsimmons to Willard.
     
  5. Duodenum

    Duodenum Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    For whatever it's worth, Miske, Carp, and Tommy Gibbons are Dempsey's defeated challengers in Canastota. For Johnson, it's Ketchel and Jeffries, and a six round title defense draw against O'Brien. I do think Dempsey's 1920-1923 quintet of Miske III, Brennan II, Carp, TGibbons and Firpo surpasses Lil' Artha's championship reign resume.
     
  6. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    So do I, but my conclusion still stands.
     
  7. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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    Had jack added destructions of langford, mcvey and johnson in his pre title run.

    If he had beaten wills as champ and tunney after hollywood.

    That's 5 if's that could lead to him being the goat today.
     
  8. janitor

    janitor VIP Member

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    I actualy wouldn't give him much credit for beating shot versions of Johnson, Langford and McVea.

    A win over Kid Norfolk would have been much better than any of the above.
     
  9. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace

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    Part of the process for new champs is defeating old champs.

    Norfolk, maybe :think
     
  10. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    Dempsey seemed to have it all ... terrific two handed power , excellent hand speed, in 1919 he moved around the ring like a young Duran, he was extremely well conditioned, physically strong as hell, had at least an extremely good chin but as important as anything the heart of a lion ... he was really a tough S.O.B. ... in addition, he had a 77" reach ... that's pretty long and could have been used ...

    I have almost never seen Dempsey throw a jab or move in behind a jab .. the Tunney , Sharkey and Brennan fights show he never really even learned how to cut off a ring properly ... I can only imagine how terrific he could have been if he had real training to graduate as a fighter and activity past 1920 ... he might have been a 190 version of Manny Paq ...

    Tyson is another excellent selection ...

    Max Baer is a interesting choice .. he definitely could have been far better. How good I'm just not sure ..
     
  11. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I'd include Michael Dokes and Greg Page on the list of candidates.

    They were the two best of the 1980s generation talent-wise, but neither made nearly the kind of mark that he could have with just a smidgen of self-discipline and dedication.
     
  12. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    And from that era I'd go with Witherspoon ... I feel he had the best package of the group but simply lacked focus and proper conditioning .. talent wise I feel he was the best package ...
     
  13. Titan1

    Titan1 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Greg Page, Michael Dokes, John Tate, possibly Tony Tucker.
     
  14. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Greg Page. If you watch him on film when he's young and in his prime, he is an all time great talent. No doubt he could have been one of the best ever. What a waste. I thought he was hands down the most talented of the 1980s heavyweights(excluding holmes/tyson) but completely blew it.
     
  15. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล

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    Khaokor Galaxy.