How would this one play out. Lyle took Foreman to war in his fight, and you would have to say that his skill, power and even style is similar (not an exact copy) to that of Foreman and while he is obviously not as good as Foreman, he showed in their fight, that he is not all that far from Foreman in ability. Lyle is probably as close to Foreman in style and power as any fighter there ever was. Frazier is obviously a far better fighter than Lyle, but was blown out by Foreman and we are constantly told by most people on this site that Frazier would never beat Foreman in 1000 fights because Styles make fights and his style was all wrong. So, is the consensus here that while Frazier is the better fighter, he has little to know chance in this one, because of his style. I am interested in what the consensus on here is about this one.
In my eyes Frazier vs Lyle was always a dream fight for me . I've always picked Lyle to win via stoppage in 7 . Lyle absorbed Earnie Shavers best punches and roared back knocking Shavers out . That tells you everything you need to know about the man . He was also one of only 2 men that can physically challenge George Foreman by going toe to toe with him On the other hand I would love to see how Lyle would react to Frazier thudding left hook . This fight would be a thriller .
Frazier would put more pressure than Quarry and get the stop over Lyle late in the fight 10th-11th round
When Foreman fought Lyle, he had only the 5 man in 1 night circus fight in over 15 months. And a round Foreman was winning was ended in 2 minutes. It should not be so close prime vs. prime. Past prime Frazier likely gets blown out if Lyle faced him in Jamaica. Prime Frazier would have a good chance.
I assume you mean prime for prime rather than when they could've fought in '76 but I'll give both. Prime vs Prime : Frazier was a much better boxer than Lyle and could take a better punch. With the constant pressure that Frazier would use I don't think Lyle would be in the fight and would probably not survive to a decision getting stopped in less than 10, but if he did manage to get to the last bell, he would lose big time. Mid '70s scenario: This fight is easier for me to asses because now the fight is more even. Lyle was no Willie Pep on his feet, but he had decent mobility for a man his size. He had a fairly quick jab with some pop to it. He threw a strong right hand but he needed room for it to gather steam. His best weapons on the inside if Frazier did get past his jab were a short left hook and a scorching uppercut. Also Ron was more then willing to stand in the trenches and swap body shots. He would have been quite a handful for Joe. What would Frazier have to do to counter Ron’s strategy? First and foremost he would just have to be Joe Frazier at his bobbing and weaving best. At times Lyle had a tendency to paw with his jab. This would have been a crucial mistake against the relentless Frazier. Joe was very adept at timing a jab and then either slipping under it or slipping to the side of it. The end result would be the same. Joe would now have his head on the opponent’s chest and he would pummel the stomach, ribs and kidneys with savage purpose. This is a fight that would probably see most of the action along the ropes. I could see Ron banging Joe a few times on the way in and then giving ground as Joe forces Ron back to the ropes. Lyle was a willing mixer with his back on the strands, so I’m sure there would have been some explosive exchanges. Although Ron had a tremendous uppercut, I can not see him landing it consistently, as Joe would have weaved away from many of them. Also, if Ron dipped his right shoulder to get more leverage on the uppercut, he would leave himself more open to Joe’s numbing short left hooks to the head. At times there would be a lot of clinching, mauling and wrestling – especially when the two boxers were in mid-ring. Lyle was good at this and his size and strength would have given Joe trouble in these situations. Ron would attempt to stall at times, but Joe would always be trying to work. Although it would not be pretty it would be enough to win Joe a few rounds just for effort and work rate. The key for a Lyle victory would be to hurt Joe early like Foreman did. Hurt Joe and not let up. Frazier was a notorious slow starter, but in most cases so was Lyle. So unless Ron timed a good one on Joe’s chin, this bout would likely become a war of attrition. The longer the fight went, the better Frazier would get. You could never count Lyle out though, because he could take you out of there with one punch, and again Foreman had shown that Joe was a mere mortal. Lyle had a good chin. He was belted by Jerry Quarry but stayed on his feet. Earnie Shavers’ “Puncher of the Century ” had Ron down but could not keep him there. Eventually it was Shavers who was brutally knocked out. Lyle gamely got off the canvas in his classic war with George Foreman, but later ended up falling as much from exhaustion as he did from Foreman’s blows. Let’s say this fight takes place in 1974 after Joe’s decision loss in his rematch with Muhammad Ali. Let’s say Frazier-Quarry II takes place, because logically there was a great demand for that fight due to Quarry’s remarkable comeback. Since Lyle’s loss to Jerry in 1973 he had re-established himself as a viable contender. Frazier-Lyle in the fall of 1974 would have been a very interesting and highly anticipated match up. Joe showed against Jerry that he was far from washed-up. Could you have imagined Frazier-Lyle as the semi-main event to Foreman-Ali in Zaire? The outcome? With all things considered and with each boxer still having the bulk of their enormous talent, I see Lyle taking an early lead. He may even score a flash knockdown against Joe. But Frazier is hungry. He feels he has the inside track for a match with the winner of Foreman-Ali. Little by little Joe works his way inside. His wrecking ball left hook is working overtime. Lyle refuses to be intimidated and he attempts to stand his ground, landing his fair share of solid counters. As the rounds progress into the sixth, seventh and eighth, Ron is spending more and more time with his back against the ropes. The tenacity of Frazier is wearing Ron down. Still, there no quit in Lyle. He is still landing enough hard shots to keep Joe honest and the fans at the edge of their seats. Finally, as the eleventh round comes along, Joe breaks through and hurts Lyle several times with the hook. Still the courageous Lyle refuses to fall, although at one point it looks like the referee was considering stepping in. Joe tries to come out fast in the twelfth and follow up on his advantage, but his attack gives way to fatigue. The final round sees both men throw desperate but almost harmless blows in a futile attempt to keep the bout from going to the scorecards. At the final bell both warriors are completely spent, fall in to each others arms, and then go to their corners to await the judges’ verdict. The decision is unanimous. The winner is Smokin’ Joe Frazier!!
Easier said then done . Lyle was a complete animal when someone took the fight to him . Frazier was knocked down to the canvas 2x and faced adversity against Bonavena and I expect Lyle to do the exact same but to get the job done and stop Frazier in the mid rnds .
No, this is exactly what wouldn't happen. It would be nothing like the Foreman bout where Frazier was just completely bombarded with punching and shoving with no time to react. Frazier is going to be able to go to work here and, despite some rough patches, should win by a decision or late stoppage.
To a slightly lesser degree than Liston, Foreman then Tyson, Lyle seems to have a real bad-ass rep which enhances the opinion some have of him as a fighter. Hence, he can tend to be over-rated by some fans in these fantasy h2h matches. As mentioned above, using Frazier & Lyle's respective performances against Foreman as a yardstick to measure the outcome of a contest between Joe & Ron is flawed in my view. Simply put, the Foreman who beat Lyle was not the same confident beast of Kingston in '73, but a fighter emotionally dishevelled by events in Zaire. If people are using Frazier's knockdowns (as a novice pro!!!) against Bonavena as evidence of Lyle's potential success against Frazier, by the same token it can be argued that if Quarry can outpoint Lyle surely Frazier can; if Ali can stop Lyle, surely Frazier can? At their respective bests Lyle was an excellent contender; Frazier a great champion. I think Bummy has this one pegged right, at their peaks I think Frazier, after evenish early rounds, grinds Lyle down, probably for a stoppage in around 12 rounds. PS - If you watch the documentary "Facing Ali", Lyle was full of praise for Frazier...he appears to rate Joe a lot higher than some on ESB do. Some people need to look past the "bad-ass" rep and the big punch when assessing fighters...it's not always that simple.
Lyle has the stylistic advantage but the gap between is to wide imo, Frazier is simply just much better, styles or not, and has to be favoured. Just because Foreman could do it doesnt mean that lesser copies of him could, its like saying Bert Cooper would beat Ali just because Frazier did.
Much respect to Ron Lyle he was a warrior and a very good fighter but I'm not a betting man but I'd be happy to bet my house on Joe Frazier in this match up. I feel its ridiculous how because Frazier got starched twice by George Foreman probably the most devastating heavyweight to ever step in the ring that people feel he would get destroyed by any other puncher. Anyway this fight would be a toe to toe war for as long it last. It wouldn't be out of the question for Lyle to perhaps drop Frazier at some point but Frazier as always would get back up and keep smokin. I see anywhere between the 5-10th round Lyle finally breaking down and trying to rest against the ropes. Frazier would continue his onslaught with Lyle's back against the ropes and it may take a minute or two of punishment to be dished out but eventually Lyle would either drop or the ref would have to stop the fight.