**Why we throw the term ATG, with such ease...**

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Orishaman, Jan 2, 2008.


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  1. Alo2006

    Alo2006 R.I.P Sean Taylor Full Member

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    I don't like using ATG unless a fighter is atleast retired.
     
    Alo2006, Jan 2, 2008
    Alo2006, Jan 2, 2008
    #16
  2. PH|LLA

    PH|LLA VIP Member Full Member

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    i think most people consider top 100 fighters ever to be atg.
     
    PH|LLA, Jan 2, 2008
    PH|LLA, Jan 2, 2008
    #17
  3. africandawg

    africandawg Active Member Full Member

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    This is such a subjective issue--ATG------P4P even the accepted no 1 of each weightdivision----you would need an unbiased panel of people prepared to research and debate the merits awarded to all boxers underconsideration-------compute the shitload of info and let the computer spit out the results-----that will keep us argueing for a long time---great fun though:smoke :smoke
     
    africandawg, Jan 3, 2008
    africandawg, Jan 3, 2008
    #18
  4. TBooze

    TBooze Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Well literally time is about 4 billion years old it is thought time may go on for another 14 billion to 30 billion years. So IMO it is highly unlikely there will ever be an all time great...
     
    TBooze, Jan 3, 2008
    TBooze, Jan 3, 2008
    #19
  5. Orishaman

    Orishaman I tell it like it is.... Full Member

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    I am not going to get into a RJJ argument and whyI don;t have him as atop 100 ATG in here, plenty of threads out there..read them..

    Now regarding Hearns and Sweat Pea you will find hard not to ahe either of them in any top 75 ATG list...
     
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    #20
  6. Orishaman

    Orishaman I tell it like it is.... Full Member

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    Little Red and Chacon are HOF but they didnlt trnascendednt liek Alexis did.....
     
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    #21
  7. Thread Stealer

    Thread Stealer Loyal Member Full Member

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    ATG is very subjective...I always rank fighters on achievements/ability/resume in the ring rather than impact/transcending the sport.

    For instance, Jack Dempsey and Mike Tyson had larger impacts on boxing than guys like Pernell Whitaker and Ezzard Charles, but they were lesser fighters so I rank them lower.
     
    Thread Stealer, Jan 3, 2008
    Thread Stealer, Jan 3, 2008
    #22
  8. Asterion

    Asterion Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I also agree that ATG > HOF.

    Rankings should consist in approximately 70% achievements and 30% toe-to-toe. Of course, there is no formula.

    Transcendance and impact on the sport have NO relevance, at least in my opinion.
     
    Asterion, Jan 3, 2008
    Asterion, Jan 3, 2008
    #23
  9. King Dan

    King Dan Golovkin Full Member

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    Mosley is an ATG and a HOF, easily.

    If you are a top 100 fighter of all time, or close to it, you are an ATG.
     
    King Dan, Jan 3, 2008
    King Dan, Jan 3, 2008
    #24
  10. bigtime9

    bigtime9 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    floyd is currently 18-0 undefeated in championship fights

    oscar was 19-0 and undefeated in championship fights (lost to trinidad)

    shane was 13-0 and undefeated in championship fights (lost to forrest)



    so in terms of accomplishments shane doesn't quite measure up in terms of winning % in championship fights to oscar or floyd. now in terms of total championship fights he does measure up well

    shane mosley championship victory % = 14/19 = 74%%
    oscar De La hoya championship victory % = 24/29 = 83%

    floyd mayweather jr. championship victory % = 18/18 = 100 %
     
    bigtime9, Jan 3, 2008
    bigtime9, Jan 3, 2008
    #25
  11. Orishaman

    Orishaman I tell it like it is.... Full Member

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    Remember that for the longest time Bert Sugar was The Ring Mag...but sure I dig what you are saying, and above all you candor about why you make your choices, if I disagreed you are not to take it personal, I know that from you..so it is cool..manym others on ESB are in agnedas for certain boxers so...they are the watch tower of the ESB public opinion on this boxers...and then you ahve the frauds..we know who they are....etc...

    A much as people think I am partial to PR boxers, which I am, when it comes to ATG's, I check my PR bash at the door and simply look at ti for pure history of the sport.
     
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    #26
  12. Orishaman

    Orishaman I tell it like it is.... Full Member

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    As much as I dislike PBF, I have never denied his ATG status, after his last year body of work...but IN MY BOOK I have him as top 50- 75 ATG...
     
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    #27
  13. kg0208

    kg0208 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Do you feel that each individual's opinion should be respected if they have what is considered a valid process of rating a fighter and no overt bias?
     
    kg0208, Jan 3, 2008
    kg0208, Jan 3, 2008
    #28
  14. Alo2006

    Alo2006 R.I.P Sean Taylor Full Member

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    I agree with ranking fighters on achievements, ablility and resume :good
     
    Alo2006, Jan 3, 2008
    Alo2006, Jan 3, 2008
    #29
  15. Orishaman

    Orishaman I tell it like it is.... Full Member

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    Well the qualifier on your statement is " Valid Process" and well unfortunately for picking ATG's you also need at least a reasonalbe understanding of the history of the sport....which should be an integral part of the process...but if they have both, then the options should norrow not to the boxers but the spots they are rank within the each list....
     
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    Orishaman, Jan 3, 2008
    #30
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