Tommy Hearns in the 1940s

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by janitor, Jun 7, 2009.


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  1. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    How would his career pan out?

    I will venture to say that he probably would not have been able to make the welterweight limit in this era. If you disagree then you may consider scenarios where he fights at welter.

    It is likley therfore that he would have campaigned at middleweight, light heavyweight and perhaps ultimately heavyweight (given that he fought over the then limit of 175 lbs).

    Here are some rankings for the decade:

    Middleweight:



    1940 Title Vacant
    1. Ken Overlin
    2. Tony Zale
    3. Billy Soose
    4. Archie Moore
    5. Steve Belloise
    6. Jimmy Bivins
    7. Al Hostak
    8. Georgie Abrams
    9. Tami Mauriello
    10. Ernie Vigh
    1941 Tony Zale Champion
    1. Georgie Abrams
    2. Ezzard Charles
    3. Ernie Vigh
    4. Coley Welch
    5. Ceferino Garcia
    6. Steve Belloise
    7. Antonio Fernandez
    8. Fred Apostoli
    9. Ron Richards
    10. Ossie Stewart
    1942 Tony Zale Champion
    1. Archie Moore
    2. Charley Burley
    3. Holman Williams
    4. Kid Tunero
    5. Jose Basora
    6. Jake LaMotta
    7. Jack Chase
    8. Eddie Booker
    9. Harry (Kid) Matthews
    10. Antonio Fernandez
    1943 Tony Zale Champion
    1. Jake LaMotta
    2. Holman Williams
    3. Coley Welch
    4. Jose Basora
    5. Steve Belloise
    6. Marcel Cerdan
    7. Joe E Carter
    8. Reuben Shank
    9. George Kochan
    10. Archie Moore
    1944 Tony Zale Champion
    1. Holman Williams
    2. Jake LaMotta
    3. Charley Burley
    4. Jose Basora
    5. Joe E Carter
    6. Vince Hawkins
    7. Cocoa Kid
    8. Coley Welch
    9. Jack Chase
    10. Vic Dellicurti
    1945 Tony Zale Champion
    1. Holman Williams
    2. Charley Burley
    3. Jake LaMotta
    4. Rocky Graziano
    5. Marcel Cerdan
    6. Bee Bee Washington
    7. Aaron (Tiger) Wade
    8. George (Wildcat) Henry
    9. Jimmy Edgar
    10. Bert Lytell
    1946 Tony Zale Champion
    1. Jake LaMotta
    2. Charley Burley
    3. Rocky Graziano
    4. Marcel Cerdan
    5. Georgie Abrams
    6. Steve Belloise
    7. Jimmy Edgar
    8. Bert Lytell
    9. Sam Baroudi
    10. Al (Red) Priest
    1947 Rocky Graziano Champion
    1. Tony Zale
    2. Bert Lytell
    3. Marcel Cerdan
    4. Steve Belloise
    5. Jake LaMotta
    6. Al Hostak
    7. Major Jones
    8. Anton Raadik
    9. Jackie Darthard
    10. Tony Janiro
    1948 Marcel Cerdan Champion
    1. Bert Lytell
    2. Steve Belloise
    3. Jake LaMotta
    4. Tony Zale
    5. Cyriel Delannoit
    6. Sylvester Perkins
    7. Dick Turpin
    8. Robert Villemain
    9. Lee Sala
    10. Rocky Graziano
    1949 Jake LaMotta Champion
    1. Sugar Ray Robinson
    2. Dave Sands
    3. Robert Villemain
    4. Tiberio Mitri
    5. Steve Belloise
    6. Artie Towne
    7. Laurent Dauthuille
    8. Lee Sala
    9. Randy Turpin
    10. Tuzo Portuguez
     
    janitor, Jun 7, 2009
    janitor, Jun 7, 2009
    #1
  2. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Light heavyweight:


    1940 Billy Conn, Champion
    1. Jimmy Webb
    2. Anton Christoforidis
    3. Melio Bettina
    4. Gus Lesnevich
    5. Teddy Yarosz
    6. Turkey Thompson
    7. Tommy Tucker
    8. Jimmy Reeves
    9. Solly Krieger
    10. Lloyd Marshall
    1941 Gus Lesnevich, Champion
    1. Booker Beckwith
    2. Ken Overlin
    3. Jimmy Bivins
    4. Mose Brown
    5. Billy Soose
    6. Anton Christoforidis
    7. Tommy Tucker
    8. Joey Maxim
    9. Erv Sarlin
    10. Lloyd Marshall
    1942 Gus Lesnevich, Champion
    1. Jimmy Bivins
    2. Anton Christoforidis
    3. Ezzard Charles
    4. Freddie Mills
    5. Lloyd Marshall
    6. Jack Coggins
    7. Nate Bolden
    8. Alabama Kid
    9. Johnny (Bandit) Romero
    10. Herbie Katz
    1943 Gus Lesnevich, Champion
    1. Lloyd Marshall
    2. Alabama Kid
    3. Eddie Booker
    4. Nate Bolden
    5. Freddie Mills
    6. Parson Bob Jacobs
    7. Bob Garner
    8. Jack McNamee
    9. Jack Coggins
    10. Billy Grant
    1944 Gus Lesnevich, Champion
    1. Lloyd Marshall
    2. Bruce Woodcock
    3. Alabama Kid
    4. Jack Johnson
    5. Freddie Mills
    6. Bob Garner
    7. Billy Grant
    8. Watson Jones
    9. Fitzie Fitzpatrick
    10. Walter Woods
    1945 Gus Lesnevich, Champion
    1. Archie Moore
    2. Phil Muscato
    3. Billy Grant
    4. Lloyd Marshall
    5. Joe Kahut
    6. Nate Bolden
    7. Jack Johnson
    8. Freddie Mills
    9. Oakland Billy Smith
    10. Fitzie Fitzpatrick
    1946 Gus Lesnevich, Champion
    1. Billy Fox
    2. Ezzard Charles
    3. Archie Moore
    4. Jack Chase
    5. Oakland Billy Smith
    6. Tommy Yarosz
    7. Johnny Colan
    8. Booker Beckwith
    9. Freddie Mills
    10. Fitzie Fitzpatrick
    1947 Gus Lesnevich, Champion
    1. Ezzard Charles
    2. Archie Moore
    3. Billy Fox
    4. Freddie Mills
    5. Tommy Yarosz
    6. Dave Sands
    7. Lloyd Marshall
    8. Bob Foxworth
    9. Oakland Billy Smith
    10. Billy Thompson
    1948 Freddie Mills, Champion
    1. Gus Lesnevich
    2. Leonard Morrow
    3. Archie Moore
    4. Dave Sands
    5. Lloyd Marshall
    6. Charley (Doc) Williams
    7. Oakland Billy Smith
    8. Artie Levine
    9. Henry Hall
    10. Dave Whitlock
    1949 Freddie Mills, Champion
    1. Joey Maxim
    2. Archie Moore
    3. Harold Johnson
    4. Leonard Morrow
    5. Bert Lytell
    6. Irish Bob Murphy
    7. Dave Whitlock
    8. Oakland Billy Smith
    9. Nick Barone
    10. Tommy Yarosz
     
    janitor, Jun 7, 2009
    janitor, Jun 7, 2009
    #2
  3. Xplosive

    Xplosive Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    All I know is that outside of Robinson and Leonard... no other welter in history beats Hearns.
     
    Xplosive, Jun 7, 2009
    Xplosive, Jun 7, 2009
    #3
  4. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    But I dont think that he would be able to make the welterweight limit in the 40s.

    He might be able to meet Robinson at middleweight or catchweight.
     
    janitor, Jun 7, 2009
    janitor, Jun 7, 2009
    #4
  5. ThinBlack

    ThinBlack Boxing Addict banned

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    Might give Napoles a shot.I don't think Tommy would do as well back then.I could see him possibly winning a welterweight belt, slim chance at middleweight, but considering that fighters often fought each other at least two, three times, chances are that someone would have his number.
     
    ThinBlack, Nov 5, 2011
    ThinBlack, Nov 5, 2011
    #5
  6. Wu-Gambino

    Wu-Gambino ESB Swordsman Full Member

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    What do you mean?
     
    Wu-Gambino, Nov 5, 2011
    Wu-Gambino, Nov 5, 2011
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  7. Son of Gaul

    Son of Gaul Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Why? Tommy ,IMO, would be damn near unbeatable at WW in any era...as long as he could make weight. Fight Day weigh-ins would hurt him but I honestly don't see anyone beating him at 147 besides SRR.
     
    Son of Gaul, Nov 5, 2011
    Son of Gaul, Nov 5, 2011
    #7
  8. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Tommy weighed in on fight day when he was a Welter.
     
    Flea Man, Nov 5, 2011
    Flea Man, Nov 5, 2011
    #8
  9. sugarsean

    sugarsean Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Agree Ray Robinson is the only one that defiantly beats him and a fight against Kid Gavilan is 60/40 in Tommy's favour for me.
     
    sugarsean, Nov 5, 2011
    sugarsean, Nov 5, 2011
    #9
  10. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Yep, Ray would bomb him out inside a couple of rounds.
     
    Flea Man, Nov 5, 2011
    Flea Man, Nov 5, 2011
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  11. thistle1

    thistle1 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    the likelyhood of Hearns actually fighting at welter would have been slim, men fought basically at their natural weight, Hearns in the 40s would have therefore had the same psyche and attitude of his peers and everyone else at the time.

    he would have been a good and capable fighter forsure, but how would that chin hold up every 3 - 5 weeks against some serious clever boxers and above all punchers?

    it's a RJJ question, and ALL others from more recent times, would they have still been top draw IF fighting that regular against fellow good & great fighters?
     
    thistle1, Nov 5, 2011
    thistle1, Nov 5, 2011
    #11
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    He's skilled and has certain physical advantages but he's not going to make it in the MW division of the 1940's. He's a LMW, and you need to be tough and durable if your smaller around this time. He'd be a very interesting night for almost anyone, but I think serious contender maybe not quite getting the title shot, a 10 year contender who grinds out a hard living gatekeeping in his thirties.
     
    McGrain, Nov 5, 2011
    McGrain, Nov 5, 2011
    #12
  13. ripcity

    ripcity Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Why not? Hearns was freakishly skinny. Some people are just freakishly skinny. I'm about 6 foot tall and up to my mid 20s I never weighed more than 145. I'm sure I could have made 130 if I was a boxer. There is no reason to think that Hearns in the 40s would not be freakishly skinny like he was in the 70s.
     
    ripcity, Nov 5, 2011
    ripcity, Nov 5, 2011
    #13
  14. MAG1965

    MAG1965 Loyal Member banned

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    Hearns would do great in any era.
     
    MAG1965, Nov 5, 2011
    MAG1965, Nov 5, 2011
    #14
  15. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I think he can beat anyone, maybe even Robinson

    Factors

    1. Weight making - I think he could make WW, he wasn't a big weight drainer to my knowledge, but he'd still be big at MW as most MWs were LMWs anyway, moving up to MW would benefit him

    2. Can he get the fights? Burley couldn't, could Hearns?
     
    PowerPuncher, Nov 6, 2011
    PowerPuncher, Nov 6, 2011
    #15
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