He's not deluded he is "limited technically". The guy has an Elite Level engine, unbelievable really and has a great heart and determination. I dont think he is deluded because all the noise coming from his camp before the fight was that he "might have to come on strong in the second half of the fight" ........ they knew that a fresh Ward at the start of the fight would be too quick and too cute and they'd have to HOPE he'd slow down enough to get caught by a determined but limited Froch. I've rarely seen Froch throw so many body punches and "arum punchees" early in a fight and this wasn't "delusion", this was a tactic aimed at asking questions of Wards stamina and slowing him down for the later rounds. I think Froch is disappointed with himself because he had more in that elite engine at the end than he thought he'd have, hence he is saying he could have laid it on a bit more than he did.
Froch did the best he could with the tools at his disposal. I agree that he has an elite level engine and granite chin, plus a decent shot when it lands. This has enabled him to do as well as he has done, grinding out hard fought victories against more skilled opponents. In Ward he simply came up against one whose skills were so vastly superior, along with fitness, determination and strength to compare with Froch's own, that he came unstuck. What I noticed watching the fight was the lack of twitch in Froch. He just doesn't possess that reflexive speed, which recedes with age no matter how fit and how hard you train. Ward was too fast, too clever and way too skilled. But yes he's head and shoulders above anyone else in the division and Froch did not disgrace himself by a long shot. His style remains an enigma to me. With his left hand held at his waist and zero head movement, he needs the speed to be able to whip in a left hook as his opponent comes in to take advantage of the gap. He doesn't have it though. He was wide open on Sat, with almost zero defence. His punches were wild as a result, as they were thrown from a poor base. He has a lot of work to do on a technical level and I'm not sure McCracken is the man to do it with. He seems more a high level conditioning coach than a boxing technician to me.
You might be right. It's one thing losing by lucky punch or robbery, but when most of your game is based around self belief, to have been beaten by someone that's just better than you must be hard to take.
Doesn't sound like he's broken hearted to me, I think he'll come back just fine. http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2011/dec/19/andre-ward-carl-froch-heart?newsfeed=true
Saying it and doing it are two different things. He's had a lot of hard fights, it remains to be seen whether he can keep going to the well. He got schooled the other night which is always mentally tough and I wouldn't envy him taking on Bute and having to deal with the problems he'll present. I don't think Froch will do much else from here, he's made the most out of his ability and had a good career.
Exactly, you think, I think. It's all speculation. Froch has had a hell of a run of tough fights and only he knows what he has left. i do agree with you that there is absolutely no point in him fighting below the top level, he needs fights that motivate him. Bute would certainly present Froch with a different set of problems to Ward and how he would cope with them is unknown. Anyway, if he wants to continue, I don't see a close decision to Kessler and a loss to a fighter of Ward's caliber as any reason to quit.
I think Clev's main struggle with Froch would be his engine and sheer iron will, Clev looked like he was losing heart in the Mohameddi fight and I can see Froch just being relentless and forcing the stoppage. Clev isn't the hardest to hit, and neither is Froch - but I'd definately favour Froch at this stage in a toe to toe battle - which it would inevitably be.
I agree, but if he loses his next fight he should. 3 losses in 5 fights wouldn't be a good look and he's getting on. Looks very very slow at the moment.
you know,i hate the word 'schooled' used in this fight,like **** he was schooled,ive said in another thread,its schooled when you lose every round,get punched to ****,lose every second of every round cal/lacy,mayweather/gatti = schooling. froch was catching ward in every round,as ward was catching froch,ward just did it a bit faster in most rounds. froch had a good 5th and decent 10th and good 11/12th,if it went 15,which is what froch would be good at,15 rounders,it sorted the men from the boys:deal he would of won,ward was gassing in the 10th,looked fcuked in the 11th,and was fubar in the 12th,clock watching:bart ward won the fight,by 8 to 4 in my eyes,now im not a judge,2 had it closer one had it wider. great fight,the best man won,schooling or calling froch delusional is a bit much,in fact its bang out of ****ing order:fire
8-4 is very generous Widdy. I find it hard to see how you gave him a 3rd round, 4 is going way too far. Froch didn't catch him clean, that was the problem. He was always cuffing him and throwing sloppy shots. Think he landed a right hand on Ward's chin once and he kept getting nailed with left hooks on the inside.
Based on the in depth article I read I think he might have quite a few if he has a bit of luck. He said he is still beating every stat he set years ago. His engine has only improved from fight to fight. Froch did not have a very good engine when he first started and made alot of fights look harder than they had to. On top of that he said he doesn't smoke and has all but quit drinking. He said he has had 1 pint in the last 6 months and that alone made him woozy. He has stopped playing football and riding his motorbike because of little injuries in the past which he does not want to happen again. I would assume by his walk around weight that he eats relatively well too. To top it all off for the last 5 years (since 29yrs old) he has only had 2 fights a year. So in his 30s he has been in the best condition possible and only going through 2 tough fights a year. It isn't difficult to teach an old dog new tricks in the gym. I'm sure within 1 day someone like Emmanuel Steward could get Froch to hold his hands up, use the jab properly etc but like you say when he gets in the ring instinct kicks in and that is SO hard to kick. ALSO, it seems that boxers are by nature self centred egotistical cocks and don't take very well to advice. This is why so many boxers sack their trainers and look for yes men. The task would also be made ALOT easier if Froch carried himself like a martial artist, training all year round. The sad truth is too many amateur boxers quickly abandon the 24/7 schedule and their development. They turn pro and their level of competition takes a huge nose dive, they are put in against different styles but guys that they dominate and blow away. There is also a huge issue with preparation. MMA has an open fraternity when it comes to sparring, learning off each other etc. Whereas boxing is all about rivalries, people hiding their skills, not revealing anything in sparring etc Everyone has to pay everyone in boxing to help each others development. DeGale won't even spar with Carl Froch for pay. It is madness. Back to the point though. I think Carl may be lucky. My only fear is that now that he is at the very highest level he may lose his hunger because he gets a few losses. Seems positive that they are already talking about 2 Bute fights next year. However that could very easily be 2 losses and I wonder if that would be it for him.
Very disappointing from Froch. It was obvious he was never going to get a decision over there anyway, let alone that he wasn't going to outbox Ward, so he should have simply thrown the kitchen sink at Ward from Round One. He may still have lost but at least he'd have given himself the best chance of winning.
Unfortunately I think it is too late for Froch to make the adjustments necessary to beat Ward. I would love to be proved wrong, but those kind of adaptations in a 34 year old fighter, especially one who isn't averse to taking shots, just don't tend to happen no matter how hard they train. He's not going to get any faster or improve his reactions at this stage in his career, he's not going to make any more than just minor refinements to his inside game or his defensive technique. It's not a matter of game plans or training to an opponents style, it's a matter of not being quite good enough and it being too late to do anything about it. He's got a huge heart and loads of guts, but that's not always enough. I think this fight was always going to be an easy one to pick.
Agreed. But Ward is an exceptional fighter. Froch has shown he can fight on level terms at least with the rest of the 168 pounders. A fight between him and Bute is very interesting.