"If you retire undefeated it means you didn't fight everyone you were supposed to"

I don't think many guys could have beat Calzaghe either. To a point everybody wanted Pavlik to beat him LOl.. I didn't think that was happening. He could of pushed himself more throughout his earlier career I guess, but not a whole lot of opposition when he retired IMO.
With Floyd, he *could* beat any of those guys mentioned (even pac and williams), but fact is he didn't. That's where his legacy is at question. Even if he beats Pac now (if pac looks good against bradley) i'd give him credit, but most of boxing will not. He missed the biggest legacy fight he could possibly have.

 

Went back and forth on this for awhile and settled on basically your conclusion. The expectation is that a fighter keeps fighting until he reaches his limit and loses. That's why you're hearing people clamoring for Floyd to win middleweight title. If Floyd actually pulled it off and beat GGG and Martinez, you would hear grmbles about Andre Ward. And if, by some miracle, he actually beat Ward, you would hear grumbles about fighting for a light heavyweight title.

Personally, I don't think it is fair, and I don't agree with it. The only person Floyd needed to fight was Pacquiao, and if he won (which I always thought he would handily) and retired right after, I wouldn't have asked for anything more from him.

If Wlad were undefeated and retired after the Povetkin fight, I have a feeling there wouldn't be too much clamoring for a Tyson Fury fight.

 

theres several.

Hopkins has NEVER shown interest in the divisionshe considers lesser, the one he never grew up with. SMW is a gooks division to him.

he was undefeated because of who he fought, is the point in being. You cant reverse that valid, foolproof point with a speculative 'he would have....', that's bum logic.

 

why would he hate Ward, guy beat him fair and square. Calzaghe on the other hand ran from his Froch defence.

 

Who Calzaghe missed for one reason or another:

Sven Ottke - linear champ for most of Calzaghes's WBO reign
Carl Froch - while he was WBC mandatory or after Hopkins
Kelly Pavlik - turned it down and left promoter to fight Jones instead
Glen Johnson - Calzaghe pulled out 2 or 3 times injured
Marucs Beyer/Eric Lucas - WBC champions during his WBO reign

No use saying he WOULD have beaten them. Some people find a way past promoters conflicts and travelling abroad to get the fights done. Imagine if he had those names on his resume replacing ones such as Ashira and Mktchian and won them all (which he might not have) - could be no possible complaints from anyone. I count 10 undeserving names for title defenses where I'm sure someone better could have been found to fight.

 

I agree with this.

Personally, I want Floyd to fight at MW since it would be an incredible challenge, good fight (and I want him to lose).

 

the ****** coward would ask hype bums to be tested.

 

Yet when someone loses or has a close fight, people on this sight start claiming they are hype jobs or got exposed. FOH you guys are so fickle. Why I hate most boxing "fans"

 

atsch

 

Me too. The only exception I can think of is Marciano.

:good:good


This thread is about Mayweather and if he never loses the biggest blemish on his record will be never taking an L...especially with all the other talented and skilled fighters in their prime that he could/should have fought along the way. He will be like Marciano except the big difference is the competition was there, there was none left for Marciano.

 

Are you kidding me? Did you just start watching boxing because you are a Floyd fan or something?

 

True. The best fight the best, and styles makes fights.

SRL, SRR, Ali, Lewis ... They all took Ls fighting the best.
Its how you bounce back from defeat ...

As amazing as Floyd is or Calzage were, the history books won't view them in the same light as the ones mentioned earlier.

 

Calzaghe could have gone to America and fought Jones in his prime. And Jones could have gone to the UK. So I blame both of them for ducking.

As for Floyd, you can't just assume he would have beaten someone he didn't fight. If he didn't fight Margarito and prime Cotto, it means Floyd himself didn't think he had good enough chances of winning.

Floyd probably watched the films of Margarito knocking out Sergio Martinez and Cotto knocking out Zab Judah, and decided he'd better "retire" for a while and wait for these guys to get knocked out.

 

:good yep.

with Calzaghe, he said he was only going to fight once more after beating Hopkins. with Jones, Pavlik and Dawson being on the list.

Dawson: brought no money to the table what so ever and had nobody really interested in the fight. that's a no go for your last fight.

Pavlik: brings the money and the fan base. but is a Middleweight. Joe was a Lightheavy. Hopkins gets credit for the win with Kelly being 10 lbs north of his division. Joe, would never get such a thing. and we know that.

Jones: brings much more money, the fans and the legacy. Calzaghe had always wanted to fight him. and you can see how attractive a fight at MSG when getting your biggest pay day against the one guy you've always wanted would be. in hindsight, considering how Pavlik and Dawson turned out, Joe definitely made the right decision.

they're the only fighters other than Sven Ottke that Joe should have fought. and Ottke wanted nothing to do with the man.

but with Froch saying what he's saying, he's just kicking out again at Joe with his comments like he always does.

it's kind of funny when he kicks out at fighters like Groves for saying things but has no problem acting like a baby when it comes to himself regarding other fighters. that's the reason it took people in the UK a long time to take to Froch. but here he is again.

i like Carl, i really do. i give him his full credit for the achievements he's got. but i want George to give him a humiliating beating in there and to knock him out. his comments that are aimed at Joe have gone beyond a joke now. he'll never be as good, nor will he surpass his achievements. so he should just shut the **** up now. having these bitchy and sniping comments going on for years just shows you how jealous Carl really is of Joe. he doesn't need to do it. but hey ho.

 

Floyd has ducked many a fight.

Joe, not once did he duck anyone. :deal he was ducked more than a few times, but never once did he duck anyone himself.