Wlad v Dempsey

your right, Jeffires was willing and I think with JD it was more of the promoter, I dont think either man was personally afraid. Its a shame the Dempsey/Wills fight never happened and Jeffries-Johnson prime may have been a much better fight for Jim

 

I hate to break the news but Waldo and Vitali didn't exactly grow up soft. Their family lived in a one room apartment in a crumbling Soviet empire military encampment in Kazakh SSR. Dad was a very strict disciplinarian who moved the family to work on the Chernobyl disaster and later died from the effort... not exactly the stuff of fairy tales.

 

Johnson was a bigger fight for Jeffires than Wils was for Jack. Much bigger.

They both ducked their biggest challenger. While Dempsey gets plenty stick over it, i never see Jeffires get any.

 

"I never see Jeffries get any."

Check McVey's posts. Jeffries gets plenty of deserved criticism.


*"Johnson was a bigger fight for Jeffries than Wills was for Dempsey"

Somewhat Monday morning quarterbacking. Wills was the top contender all the way through Dempsey's reign. Johnson only emerged in 1903. That Johnson would go on to be a top all-time great could not be known in 1905 when he lost to Marvin Hart.

 

Because , I who have NEVER seen Jack Dempsey ringside, have MORE
faith in the opinions of men like Sam Langford, Mickey Walker, Jack
Sharkey, Max Schmeling, Ray Arcel, and dozens of great boxing veteran scribes who saw the prime Dempsey fight, and voted him by a large
majority, the best heavyweight they had ever seen [pre-Tunney]. And sir
I have never seen nor heard Daniel Webster speak but I go along with historians who called Webster, the greatest American orator. I think for
today's Dempsey detesters to demean his ability in his prime, holds a
hell of a lot less authority, than hundreds of veteran fighters and trainers who saw him and his successors fight, and held the tough Manassa Mauler
in such high esteem. Why the heck read history if you believe that YOU
today, know more about the past than those who LIVED and experienced it ? And to be reviled for being a nostalgic guy, I still insist jOE LOUIS;
RAY ROBINSON, WILLIE PEP, AND EZZARD CHARLES,were the best fighters of their divisions I have ever seen,though they fought 70 years ago...
So sue me for nostalgia...On this site I've been called worse...

 

I know the story and I know their extensive amateur career but Dempsey was training, soaking his hands and skin in brine when he was 8 years old, fighting undernourished against grown men as a boy, Dempsey was as mean as a junk yard dog and while I respect Wlad as a professional and an intelligent man both in the ring and out and do not question his heart in fact he got up against Sanders and Brewster and Peter.

But on another note, I dont think JD would have had Derrick Chisora slap him at a weigh in or spit water in his face without kicking him in the gonads

Dempsey was a mean junk yard dog and came from the school of hard times and hard knocks

 

I get the feeling that Jack Dempsey is such a touchy subject with you that a straight answer to a straight question probably is too much to ask for - so I will press the matter no further. Have a nice day.

 

HA! Pure fantasy.

 

So Mango, I am "touchy" if I defend a Jack Dempsey who MAINLY on this site is so often bashed by some misguided posters, whilst you in your
esteemed boxing knowledge can have free reign to demean his abilities ?
So sir, you can say whatever you wish regarding Dempsey, whilst I am called "touchy" for defending him ? This is America sir, and I will defend this long dead fighter however I wish and to be called touchy by you and your fellow bashers, will not stop me from what I feel in my heart.
P.S. I will match my boxing knowledge of ring history with you any round...:hi:

 

JD had no problem finding the chin of bigger fighters. Guys like Klitschko were tailor made for him. People don't seem to realize just how agile JD was, and how he could move in and out like a mongoose against a cobra. You had to be a fast guy with good solid defense to withstand Dempsey, and a good chin to absorb the odd haymaker that inevitably penetrated good defense.

Marciano-Klitsscko? Not so sure RM would find VK's chin, but as it stands, I think this fight could be a push.
Source:yahoo

 

I'm assuming he would be exactly what he was at his best 185 pounds. Reality is a hard taskmaster.

 

I dont know if you have noticed - but Im a newcomer here, a "newbie". I dont claim to be an expert - and yes, if it comes to matching knowledge Im sure you know 100 (literally!) times more about the sport than I do.

I signed up here only last month and after a while I come across this poster who calls people who dont agree with him "haters" and "detesters". I found this very strange and thought I would ask you why. I believe I did this in a polite way - without criticizing you or Mr. Dempsey (or even expressing an opinion on the latter). But all I get back from you is an angry response - where I now find myself being accused of bashing Dempsey and demeaning his abilities. I have never done any such thing and dont know why you would throw that in my face! I have, out of curiosity, asked you a simple question - that is all I have done. But if that somehow has offended you I apologize.

 

"Reality is a hard taskmaster"

And the reality is a man only lives and fights in his own time.

Any cross-era match-ups are inherently unreal and mainly fantasy.

It is one thing to say Wlad did more in his era than Dempsey did in his. Fair enough.

It is quite another to base superiority on anyone's opinion of a fantasy match.