If Muhammed Ali was never banned from boxing how would his career pan out?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by swagdelfadeel, Sep 28, 2014.


  1. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    I think most can now agree that Frazier would never have beaten ALI, if not for the exile. They would have fought in 69, as they were slated to, not in 71. Frazier would have been approaching his prime and ALI would still be in his. Frazier applies great pressure but it proves to be his undoing.

    The only thing that remains the same as in the real world is the Post-ALI, Frazier. That version of Frazier was never the same after ALI 71. He won but he was severely damaged and could never get up for any other fighter besides ALI. In this reality, Frazier suffers the same but loses by a wider margin.

    I'm sick of people ranking Norton so high. It's all based on his series with ALI, which never would have unfolded if not for the exile. ALI would have fought both Norton and Frazier twice, beating them each time and eliminating any need for a third fight.

    ALI would have also defended the title against George Foreman in 73. His series with this trio would have gone as follows.

    W 15 Frazier, 1969
    4 fights against contenders. Liston might actually have earned a rematch in this time. He made a decent run towards the end of the 60s.

    Frazier avoided a rematch with ALI in the real world as he took about 3 years to heal. I see similar here.

    TKO 13 Norton 1972
    TKO 12 Frazier 1972
    TKO 9 Foreman 1973: No rope-a-dope here. ALI takes more time to wear Foreman down as the fight takes a much different tempo. Foreman spends a lot of time swing and missing but ALI works different from ring center, rather than the ropes.

    I see a rematch with Foreman sometime in 74. However, ALI doesn't decline as rapidly as he did in the real world. He was a shot fighter by 75. His life outside the ring took a toll and his terrible habit of not training did also. That might be slightly different as he would never have the time to meet some of the shady people he met during his exile.
     
  2. Berlenbach

    Berlenbach Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Frazier would beat Ali before or after the lay-off.
     
  3. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    :lol: a rusty ali with 2 warm ups almost killed frazier litteraly and gave him a close fight. frazier was in the hospital for a month.
    the scores were
    9:6 Frazier
    8:6:1 Frazier.
    11:4 Frazier.
    Yes, that's how close it was.So in essence all the peak 1967 Ali has to do is not get knocked down and win one more round. Hell, I don't want to upset any Frazier fans but I think a peak Ali has more than one extra round in the bag and the ability to stay erect for the distance over the 1971 Ali.
     
  4. Berlenbach

    Berlenbach Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Frazier just had the right combination of style and attributes to defeat Ali, and would beat him at least once before or after the layoff, IMO. Ali could never have held Frazier off. He didn't hit hard enough, and Frazier was too good at putting on pressure and also possessed Ali's kryptonite, a quick, powerful left hook.

    It's easy to sit there predicting easy victories against fighters who gave Ali hellish struggles when he actually fought them in reality, but that's just how I see it. Even limited guys like George Chuvalo and Karl Mildenberger gave 'prime' Ali tough fights, and Frazier was immeasurably more formidable than them.
     
  5. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    ali hadn't fought for four years, he was more inactive than frazier no matter how you put it.
     
  6. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    how do you know this? that was 70's ali. 60's ali and 70's ali are 2 completely different people. 70's ali lost to frazier that wasn't the best ali that wasn't even the best 70's ali.
     
  7. 2piece

    2piece Well-Known Member Full Member

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    If Chuvalo can get to Ali so can Frazier, with more punches and more damage. He'd catch Ali dancing with left hooks that were like the one's in the 15th round.
     
  8. Foxy 01

    Foxy 01 Boxing Junkie banned

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    I've great time for both guys, but it is crazy to think the pre ban Ali was as slow on his feet as the 70's version, and the quicker one doesn't get hit anything like as many times by Frazier.
     
  9. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    what do you mean by getting to ali? getting inside?
     
  10. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing

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    exactly.
     
  11. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    What amazes me is how the most famous boxer of all time still gets his name spelt wrong.:huh:patsch
     
  12. benebox

    benebox Active Member Full Member

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    The time off probably gave his chin time to heal. I'm putting it out there, 70's Ali was better, there is more to boxing than being fast.
     
  13. Webbiano

    Webbiano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Agree with your swag assumption delfadeel. Without the lay off he probably goes unbeaten through 74-80 and dominates future ATGS in Holmes and Berbick and asserts himself as the undisputed GOAT
     
  14. Stevie G

    Stevie G Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He would have kept going until the early/middle seventies beating Frazier and Foreman along the way. It's possible that a complacent champion underestimates Ken Norton around 1973 and loses a close decision as in the real world. De ja vu again as Muhammad evens the score in the rematch

    Because Ali would have beaten Frazier twice,he would have had no need for a 'Manilla' It's quite feasible that he would have retired after the second Norton fight as there would have been no more worlds left to conquer.

    During the late seventies he may have been tempted to come back and fight Larry Holmes. An ageing Muhammad loses to the younger man but as Ali would n't have taken so much punishment as he did in reality,he would have put up a far better fight than in real time
     
  15. stevo1966

    stevo1966 Member Full Member

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    Boredom and superstardom would be his enemy (not the govt), and by 68/69 who or what is left? Don't think a third Liston or second Patterson fight happens , so only Joe presents a challenge in the ring. Maybe his ambition has stretched to other avenues ( businessman, ambassador etc...) and he maybe has a sabbatical for a couple of years, coming back just in time for Frazier and the exact same career path. I guess what I am saying is that whatever the circumstances, he is still going to have come back again and again and forged the same amazing career whether with one more or one less frazier fight here or Norton fight there. He was driven and determined to be thought of as the best and I don't think history pans out too differently with or without layoffs.