John L Sullivan Training Camp

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mike South, May 17, 2015.


  1. Mike South

    Mike South Member Full Member

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    So I know this sort of thing has been posted before, but I've found two good primary sources, and I've done some background research to explain some things that have not been adequately explained before. My sources are Sullivan's autobiography (http://www.forgottenbooks.com/books/Life_and_Reminiscences_of_a_19th_Century_Gladiator_1000516535)
    (link has a free read online option) and Nellie Bly's account of her visit to William Muldoon's camp for the Kilrain fight (http://www.bareknuckleboxinghalloffame.com/id2.html).

    Here are a couple of things to keep in mind: First the differences in the sports - bareknuckle versus MDQ. This has been gone over a lot so I'll spare you, except to say the routine outlined here is what Sullivan undertook for his few bareknuckle bouts, rather than for his hundreds of four round MDQ gloved bouts.

    Second, Sullivan trained in an era that predated water chlorination or even widespread pasteurization. People in those days were afraid of fresh water. For this reason Sullivan drank no cold water (he even showered using salt water), fearing that it could be filled with germs (bacteria or protozoa) that could make him sick. At his meals he drank tea, and his post workout "shake" was boiled beef broth. Muldoon also allowed Sullivan between 1 and 5 beers per day (Bass Ale) for 3 reasons; first because beer was safe to drink compared to fresh water, second because people of that time didn't realise just how bad for you alcohol was (alcoholism was seen as a weakness of character not a chemically induced disease), and third, Sullivan was an alcoholic, and it may have been prudent to slowly wean him off of it rather than have him quit cold turkey. Delirium tremens (the shakes) can be fatal to an alcoholic who is forced to go cold turkey.

    It is often noted that fresh fruit and vegetables were rarely served to old time boxers. Again, this was the fear of food poisoning. A raw peach could be poisoned simply by "washing" it in fresh water. Stewed fruits and vegetables were substituted. The trainers of the day didn't know that they were boiling out the vitamins as well as the harmful germs.

    Sullivan, however, made one worthwhile choice that broke the mold - he ate celery. Celery provided him with fibre, as well as additional water. Celery has very few calories. It was Sullivan's preferred snack and Muldoon let him eat as much of it as he wanted.

    Sullivan lived intemperately and he knew it. His drinking is well documented, but he was also a smoker (cigars) and he had a prodigious appetite for food and women. He was married but he spent little time at home, and the marriage produced no offspring. This was the lady with whom he spent most of his time: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lillian_Russell. I'm not usually one to scandalize the reputation of a lady, but suffice to say that she was married four times in an era when divorce was scandalous, and one of her four husbands was Diamond Jim Brady. She was also married (to someone else) during the time she spent with Sullivan.

    In order to "counteract" the effects of his intemperance, Sullivan began each training camp with a two week "cleanse". This involved the application of emetics and physics. To be clear, an emetic is a medication that makes you vomit. A physic is a laxative. This is a very dangerous thing to do to yourself as the risk of dehydration is great, especially if you are an alcoholic (alcohol dehydrates and some of the adverse effects of alcohol are linked to dehydration) or if you aren't drinking enough water to begin with (Sullivan met both these criteria), but one would certainly lose weight (mostly water) during these two weeks.

    Thereafter his diet was hot oatmeal, well-cooked meats, fried eggs, dry bread and tea, with boiled beef broth and celery between meals. By the end of his camp he was drinking only one Bass Ale a day with his lunch.

    The workout was an all-day affair. Sullivan trained before the advent of the internet, TV, movies or even radio. Sullivan could read, play pool, listen to the grammophone, or engage in conversation if he wanted to relax. In other words, spare time was not as coveted then as it is now because there was not as much to do with it. Also, the fight itself could be an all-day affair, so it was best to train all day.

    Here's the routine:

    0600: Rise and short workout with dumbells (Sullivan used hand weights - 2lbs to 4lbs)
    0630: Walk 1 to 1.5 miles from camp and run back as quickly as possible
    0700: Breakfast. Followed by a rest to allow for digestion. Sullivan and Muldoon would also read the paper so they had something to talk about during the next 2 hours of "roadwork".
    1030: Two hours of walking and running intervals, cross-country. Sullivan claimed that he covered 12 miles during this two hour period. He also wore a thick belt, like a weightlifter's belt during this phase as he thought it helped to reduce stomach fat.
    1230: Shower, towel rubdown, lunch and rest (If Sullivan was training near salt water he would swim 10-15 min before lunch). The towel rubdown was done to keep the muscles supple, but also to clean the body of salt and water.
    1430: 1.5-2.5 hours of gym work. "We wrestle, punch a bag, throw a football, swing Indian clubs (weighted bowling pins) and dumbbells, practice the chest movement (with a chest expander: http://www.oldtimestrongman.com/products/chest-expanders) and such things until suppertime". In the Bly article, the author notes that the football used for the throws is larger and heavier than a normal ball. Sullivan did not spar in these camps. Most of his sparring was done during his hundreds of MDQ exhibitions.
    After supper, Sullivan preferred to remain active until bedtime so his limbs didn't stiffen up. He would play pool, or go for a walk or, if just hanging out, he would remain on his feet rather than sit.
    2100: Bedtime. Sullivan would do another short workout with light dumbells before retiring.
     
  2. UnleashtheFURY

    UnleashtheFURY D'oh! Full Member

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    Very interesting read. Thanks for posting :good
     
  3. Brixton Bomber

    Brixton Bomber Obsessed with Boxing banned Full Member

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    Great read.

    The old guys (although some of the routines are more like fables) trained like animals!
     
  4. Mike South

    Mike South Member Full Member

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    Thank you for reading. The links are also worthwhile.
     
  5. Brock Rock

    Brock Rock Member Full Member

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    Great read. Very interesting.
     
  6. Arminius

    Arminius Member Full Member

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    That is very interesting. Celery as his snack was a wise decision.
     
  7. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Thanks Mike. Haven't seen you post here in a while
     
  8. kingfisher3

    kingfisher3 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    a few things that were to his detriment but a reasonable regime i think.

    thanks for that, the water stuff was particularly interesting, i knew the basic science history but hadn't realised it was avoided so scrupulously or the effect that has on the rest of his diet..
     
  9. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Thanks for posting this.I've read Nellie Blys account.:good
     
  10. Ted Spoon

    Ted Spoon Boxing Addict Full Member

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    You'll note that many of these exercises remain core ones. Interval running, punching with dumbbells, bag work. Sullivan's filmed attempt at the speed ball is underwhelming to say the least, but oddly enough it illustrates the fact such a piece of equipment is not necessary for a man to have (who had) great accuracy and timing.

    While improvements to training and nutrition are indisputable I would also vouch that their worth is exaggerated. Similarly, modern exercises are questionable. Routines with foam bars have more gimmick than utility in them.

    Consider the flip-side, what training has lost. Back in Sullivan's day, and for many years after, boxer's ran fully clothed with less than ideal footwear for many miles. Training itself was carried out in less favourable conditions which in fact complemented that robust streak. And when it came to being meticulous, it didn't get any more thorough than Fitzsimmons' timetable.

    More than any other sport, the veil must be lifted from each era in boxing to clarify the similarities. It's human nature to seek out differences and the reason every new fan points the finger to declare, "These oldies don't know what they're doing."

    In a sentence, Sullivan's routine is not some dead sea scroll.
     
    MrPook and cross_trainer like this.
  11. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    I can't my pins healthy running a few miles a few times a week in $120 running shoes... reminds me of what a bunch of pussies we have become.
     
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  12. CONSTAR

    CONSTAR Boxing Addict banned

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    I remember reading about Sullivan training to fight kilrain the camp sounded brutal
     
  13. Mike South

    Mike South Member Full Member

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    Thanks for remembering me.
     
  14. Mike South

    Mike South Member Full Member

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    All true. But also, imagine going into camp knowing that the first two weeks of was going to be nothing but vomiting and diahrrea... no wonder he preferred 4 rd exhibitions!
     
  15. Mike South

    Mike South Member Full Member

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    Oct 25, 2005
    Fellows, if you go to the forgotten books link and select the free read online option, Sullivan has written an entire chapter on his training, starting on page 254. Cheers.