Where does Ali rank P4P?

Not that this is the be all, end all but there are 5 guys who beat 30 or more top 10 contenders (as close as I can reckon).

Ray Robinson
Archie Moore
Henry Armstrong
Emile Griffith (I think)
Joe Louis
And Muhammad Ali

So he has as deep a resume as anyone (Moore, Charles, and Robinson have over 40). Ali is not at the bottom of that list either. He's above Louis and Armstrong. Plus he has wins over 4 undisputed champions, and a few other titlist. He had winning records against a half dozen hall of famers.

How else do we measure boxers? Longevity? Ali win his first title fight in 1964 and his last in 1978; he was by acclamation one of the 3 best guys in his division for a decade and a half. Dominance? Ali had only two close calls in his first career and made mincemeat out of the division. In his second he was more a first amongst equals, albeit against perhaps the deepest heavyweight class of all time. Headed to head? By consensus Ali is one of the greatest heavyweights in that regard; critics routinely list him near the top or at least in the top 5.

So yeah he was pretty good.

 

No heavyweight should be ranked above Ali.

 

YDKSA Joe.

 

Of course it's not the sole criteria, but it weighs heavily for me. There are no more difficult or important fights than those for undisputed titles.

 

Good summation.

I'd add that probably only Louis beats his record in fights for the undisputed title.

So, he's perhaps third in the list of wins over ranked opposition and second in wins for the undisputed title. And the only one at the top of those lists to have lost a good chunk of his best years to forced inactivity.

I think that's a strong case for top 5 p4p. Probably a solid case for top 3 even.

 

It boils down to the criteria you choose to use.

You could definitely make a case for ranking Ali at number 1


Personally, I have him at 5.





SRR
Greb
Langford
Armstrong
Ali

 

Somehow I left Ezzard Charles off the list, but included him in the aside about 40 wins. So there's that.

 

So you put him over Louis at heavyweight, I take it?

 

He definitely belongs in the all time top 5. I rate him the third best,P4P for the seventies alone...a decade where all his work was post prime.

 

Obviously number 1. There are boxers and then there is Muhammad Ali who is in a list by himself.

 

Yes.

At heavyweight, I have:

Ali
Louis
Lewis / Foreman

Marciano / Holmes

Liston / Frazier / Tyson


Wlad Klitschko



At p4p, I would have Louis at 9 or 10.

 

I am never sure how literally to take the p4p math, Do you need to divide there actual weight by how good they were?

 

Good question. I guess you pretty much have to imagine how they would all due if they were the size of Marciano. On that score l doubt Ali comes out on top so l'm sure it's essentially ignored.

 

Which is why it doesn't make much sense at heavyweight they size differences are just too great.

 

top-5, yes

great handspeed.. welterweight like at times. nearly unmatched footwork at any weight class (see: ali shuffle.. have you ever tried that?). great chin. notable courage in a sport that thrives on it. great athlete of the kind that are born, not made. preternaturally relaxed, no matter how bright the lights, leading to optimum performance. headhunter, but accurate, accurate, accurate.