Hagler vs Jacobs of GGG fight

Hagler would stop Jacobs some point late in the fight. And it wouldn't even be that close..

 

You make great points, V. Nice to see you back!! However, I did write elite lightheavies. Tiger beat Torres at 175 after losing to Griffith. I don't think Torres was an elite lightheavy. I don't think Joey Maxim was an elite lightheavy. Pavlik moved directly up to fight Hopkins at 170. Considering Bhop's lightheavy record was 9 wins 4 losses 2. draws/no contests (no ko victories there either), I don't consider him an elite lightheavy either. And I agree with most of your post. But I also wrote in recent memory. Guys like Greb and the like don't fit in that category. Perhaps I'm just splitting hairs, but Hagler never in his career spoke about moving up to 175 and never ducked anyone.

 

No. It isn't.

I do not see how pointing out that career-welterweight Brook went straight back down to 147, after facing Golovkin at Middleweight, is being "slanted". It is a fact.

Brook was also clearly the smaller guy in the ring against Golovkin. Our own observations can confirm that. He wasn't even bigger than Spence, at 147.

Also - Which opponents did Hagler ever compete against, who immediately went back down to Welterweight, afterwards? I don't think any did, in fact most eventually went up and beyond Middleweight. So that's likely another fact that underlies a lack of slant in addressing Impacted's post.

Have either Golovkin or Jacobs attempted any serious campaign at Super Middleweight or Light Heavyweight? I don't think so. Does mentioning this, in answer to a comment about Hagler not seeking out ATG Light Heavyweight Spinks, make my post slanted?

Hagler is considered an ATG
Hagler fought other boxers who are considered ATGs.
Hagler is often found in Top-5 ATG Middleweight listings.

Sorry, but I was responding to a comment about Hagler being overly lauded - so, I can't see any slant here, either


You might deem that my omission of Canelo's recent outing against Chavez placed a slant on my post. Personally, I do not consider this qualifies as a fully-fledged test at 160. That is: I don't particularly find it a reliable gauge.

You might disagree and that's fine - but, I think it would be overstating the case - as you have done - to imply Canelo is bigger than Golovkin. That is much closer to 'a surrender of one's integrity'.


The size of a boxer is neither determined, absolutely, by height nor weight. Lean body mass (not fat or temporary water weight) is a better indicator of actual size. Come fight night, Canelo will, as did Kell Brook, most likely look small against Golovkin, regardless of their respective hydration levels.


Canelo's advantage over Golovkin is youth; not size. And, should Canelo get hammered in his first genuine Middleweight World Title Fight, where do you think he will go next?

 

Hagler chopped down taller opponents and feared punchers Hearns and
Obelmejias and can't see why Jacobs no different.

 

Thanks and good post. I'll start by first agreeing with your last sentence, the rest is just fun speculation.

Maxim and Torres are certainly not on Spinks level but guys can only fight who is available in their era and while i don't think much of Maxim he does have a few very stellar wins and Pastrano is a favourite of mine so Torres winning the title against slick Willy is pure class in my mind.

lol Come on now. Hopkins losing to Calzaghe (very close) and his overall LHW record considering his age shouldn't be used to diminish the context of Pavlik's challenge. He was basically the 1B LHW and Pavlik moving up 10lbs to challenge him when he didn't have to was a ballsy move in the grand scheme of things.

Spinks is a nightmare ask but something i have never seen mentioned, something slightly more realistic, and way way more fun to think about is Qawi. He was WBC champ what if Duran stayed at 154 and Hagler fought Qawi instead. He would have to try and use his silky smooth boxing skills and do his best Spinks imitation, with his movement resembling a seizure less, over 15 rounds no less. If he's unable to do that with success, which i suspect he wouldn't, it would be a Mugabi scenario against a sadistic war machine. Marvin's chin might get cracked in that one.

I curse the Gods that motion pictures weren't invented 30 years earlier so we could have a much less sporadic documentation of an era when no fuc3s were truly given.

 

Another terrific post on your part. You've been missed. Yes, Willie was very cool. But Jose lost to Tiger after Dick had lost to Emile Griffith. I believe that that says a lot. However I don't wholly agree with your 3rd paragraph. The fact remains that Calzaghe wasn't a lightheavy and neither BHop nor him was prime in that one. As far as Kelly is concerned, his best weight was 160 and yes it was a ballsy move on his part. And no question what Hopkins accomplished at his age was extraordinary. But Kelly was not a lightheavy, and he moved down after that fight. Bhop's resume at 175 really isn't anything to write home about. I also happen to personally believe that Spinks and Qawi hammer all of the middles and lightheavies that we've both mentioned in our conversation.

 

I have been having the 'size' argument a lot, both in Classic and in General, lately.

The difference in 'walk around weights', 'rehydration weights' and 'weight cutting' all add up to a certain side of that debate - but, I take the view that 'size' is more to do with Lean Body Mass than how much a boxer weighs at different times, under varying circumstances.

I also see clear differences in size, when I see the fighters in question, together.

Other people see it differently and that's fine. I just disagree with them.

 

A Draw

 

Hagler would beat Jacobs up badly. Quite honestly, so would a prime Golovkin. Clearly GGG has slowed tremendously.

 

I feel you could be right because Hagler couldn`t cut the ring off against Leonard plus Duran got in some good right hands but his reach wasn`t good enough at middle, Hagler had great reach but Jacobs is taller and big so I feel he would score more rights than Roberto I also feel Jacobs would have been able to beat a fighter Duran`s size but Marvin would stand a much better chance against Jacobs than he would of against a hard punching light heavy like Spinks, that was a little unfair, maybe Marvin could have beaten some top 10 light heavies because he had the reach to fight at light heavy but he was so short I feel that would of harmed him and left him open to Spinks right too much.

 

Fighting Ward would have been unreasonable in terms of expecting GGG to fight him at that weight as Ward was an awesome fighter anyway giving him an edge like moving up in weight wouldn`t be fair on GGG, I don`t know how their reach compares because I don`t know if there was ever a fighter than could have beaten a super skilled boxer like Ward whilst giving away reach, none of the above boxers that moved up fought anyone even close to Ward`s prowess at light heavy even though he was better at super middle, the only two that would bothered him was RJJ and Hopkins, I don`t feel any of the others were as effective as they were at the lighter weights.

 

I think Hagler`s jab would only be a factor if he had the longer reach though, who had the longer reach, I know Marvin`s reach was impressive.

 

Moore was a light middle though when comparing Hagler with Jacobs you have to look at what Jacobs fought a tiny middle like Duran, he defo would have caused more problems than Moore did could you imagine more vs GGG in their respective eras?!