CW: Toney (Jirov fight) vs Haye (Mormeck fight) HW: Toney (Holyfield fight) vs Haye (Wlad/Chisora fights) Vote and discuss
CW- Haye would win HW- Toney would win I just don’t rate Haye at HW. That spectacular win against Chisora now looks less impressive in hindsight. All of Hayes best wins are at CW. The Toney who beat Holyfield was very strong and that was a version of Toney that would drag Haye into deep waters and drown him.
Agree mate. Losses like these tarnish a legacy. That’s just stone cold truth. Roy Jones damaged his legacy badly by dropping down from HW and then getting bounced around like a beach ball, by some average fighters. Likes of Glen Johnson, Danny Green and Enzo were his poorest losses.
Haye at cruiser was better than Jirov ever was. Both counter punchers, both prefer opponents to come to them because of this. Haye has size, power, movement in his favour, but Toney is the superior defensive fighter and counter puncher. I'd favour Haye. Just think with his size and style he'll eek out a decision win. Wouldn't be easy, Toney will punish him when he over commits and wouldn't be shocked to see Haye have to pick himself up off the floor from a sneaky counter punch. At heavyweight. Toney that beat Holyfield has a shot, that Toney was still is decent shape and clearly roided to the eye balls. But Haye still has an edge in style and Holyfield by then was totally shot.
Not an easy decision, but Toney could box, Haye was wild, so Tony would have a chance................
Toney is underrated, a real elite boxer. Haye, not sure you can class him elite, based on unifying the "loser subdivision" of HW and a brief stint as HW titlist. Maybe he was elite. Having said that, a razor close decision split for toney.
Toney of Jirov beats any cruiser Haye. Nearly any heavyweight version of Haye, though, beats the heavyweight Toney of Peter II onward.
I disagree completely with the Chisora win being less spectacular now. If theres anything we know about Chisora, when hes motivated and determined, he puts on a good performance. Chisora probably had all time career high, motivation and determination levels for the David Haye fight due to the build up there was so much pride on the line for both men, it was a must win for both or you really do look like a fool. Pride is a big thing in London thats why arguably one of Chisoras best performances in which he actually lost controversially came against Dillian Whyte, there was pride and ego at stake and thats when Chisora is fully motivated. For David haye to beat a fully determined in shape Chisora and not just beat him but to be the first man to ever put him down and out, is very impressive in my eyes. I believe, prior to the David Haye bout Chisora had never hit the canvas as a Pro/Amateur or sparring.
Toney @ CW & HW. Even though, Jirov doesn't have Haye's power he had a stupid workrate. Punchstats had him throwing 1,000 plus, Credited for landing 243 to JT's 380 landed. Has Haye landed 300 punches in 3 fights? JT style is way too wrong for a haymaker. I'm not looking at the fact Haye lost to Thompson at CW, rather his workrate. At 23 years young he ran out of gas against Carl T. Needed an oxygen mask after the fight. As a HW, he barely landed 100 punches against Valuev or Klitschko. Since JT isn't a forward aggressive, fighter, guess who is going to lead? Toney doesn't dance, doesn't run, his throwback style demands for Haye to be the aggressor. Yet, Haye doesn't throw combos effectively & damn sure doesn't fight inside. Only way Toney loses is the non-motivated version. And that was at MW & SMW. At CW Toney was pretty consistent, the way he beat Porter, McGroom and ESPN showed a great clinical performance over Adolpho Washington, James was too quick & when Adolpho stopped charging in to get tagged, JT had the ability to look like he was slipping a punch, but comes in to attack, and because he is always so low and constantly turning at an angle, how does Haye respond to that? JT wins at CW easily. AT Heavy depends... JT looked like a big azz milk dud against Rahman. Sloppy, Haye could outpoint that version of JT. The version that beat Ruiz, or Peter first fight...no chance in hell for haye.
Would be fun to see but Haye's physical advantages prolly too much for JT. Haye should have tried to make this fight, but he was always risk averse.
This. I think Toney wins at Crusierweight and Heavyweight (barring the exception you noted). And frankly, I think crusierweight Jirov probably beats Haye as well.