Beautifully put. My memory of it is that Ali fought those first few rounds like a guy who thought he didn't need to conserve his energy because he'd have Frazier out of there quickly. By the 5th, it was clear Frazier wasn't going anywhere and Ali had already spent a lot of what he had and Joe took over and battered him on the ropes. Ali knew he was taking too much of a beating so eventually had to try and box his way out of trouble. I love fights with shifts in momentum - they add to the drama - and Ali-Frazier 3 is one of the great examples of that in heavyweight history.
It's all a matter of personal preference really, but if you genuinely believe Bowe-Holyfield 3 was better than Ali-Frazier 3 then I don't know what to tell you.
Thrilla in Manilla, ROUND 11 Don Dunphy: “I’ve seen a lot of them, but this has got to rank with Louis and Conn, Marciano and Walcott and the first Ali-Frazier fight. This is one of the great ones.” That's in round 11 and Dunphy had indeed seen (and commentated on) many of the greatest aforementioned heavyweight fights. That's good enough for me.
At age 66 I can say the trilogy truly was the Saga of My Lifetime and Manila as a fight is untoppable
Interesting it bothers you that Ali and Frazier were in their 30s but you put Bowe/Holyfield above it. Evander was not himself that night. It had nothing to do with Bowe who was closer to the end that Ali or Frazier were in Manila. Holyfield had Hep and be could hardly breathe. Even after decking Bowe he had no wind to throw any punches. The 1st fight I could see that being near the Thrilla.
Yes definitely. Ali thought he was gonna do what Foreman did. Ali hit Frazier with sizzling flurries, clean right hand lead. They were clean and would have put down any other heavyweight fighting at that time. What gets me about that fight was the hatred. It wasn't from Joe as much as it was Ali. Joe was mad but once the bell rang Frazier was in heaven. Ali's face looked like the Devil in those early rounds. He was trying to kill him but also dehumanize him at the same time. Like squashing an Insect.
Ali couldn't move around for 15 rounds because of a conbinatiicn of Joe's pressure and Ali's aging legs. If he could have, it would have been less exciting. He couldn't do it against Foreman, either. It is interesting to imagine how Ali would have fared against Foreman or Norton if they came of age in the mid 60s or if Ali met Frazier in 1967. His movement would have likely been better than when he actually faced them.
Yes but others may say seeing two old fighters past their prime showing their deficiencies while absorbing terrible punishment in quasi-slow motion is not a great fight. If it were not Ali and Frazier but two unknowns many would say it was a good fight but hardly one of the highest rated of a generation. To me Norton-Holmes, Holyfield -Bowe 1, Tua - Ike or Lewis - Mercer are examples of much better fights.
That's a fair point and while you suggest strong examples of better fights, imo none of them are greater fights. They lack the intangibles that makes the Thrilla so special. I doubt they'll ever make a film of any of those three. Another factor which may have lessened the quality but adds to the legend was the conditions Ali and Frazier were facing. If you crank up the heat and humidity in the three you mention To Manila levels they may well be in quasi slow motion as well.
I've seen the fight a few times now and I gotta agree with you .I watch it and think ,am I missing something , because it's not the greatest of fight s by a long shot .Yes , both guys tried hard in there but from a certain point you realize that Joe stand s no chance . Frazier took over in the middle round s , that was his best shot but you can see him getting tagged more frequently.Yes , it's an important fight in some respects , the last meeting of the two but it's not the classic it's made out to be .
