Isn't it a bit naive to expect past era fighters to be competitive against modern fighters...?

Hi Carl Childers / Black Hercules whatever. I knew you'd be back.

 

I AGREE with almost everything you say here, almost.

I don't agree modern is better, it isn't boxing suffered a huge decline by the 70s, OF COURSE their have been some good and great fighters since, of course, BUT would they still be great had they had to survive 200 fights against a good level of Top and/or Noted fighters - ???

think RJJ verse Tarver, jones would have met many a Tarver in bygone times sooner and more frequently - maybe he would have stayed relevant, maybe not... but the point remains the same.

again in agreement with you, using Roy as an example in the 40s Jones would have been a L-HW come HW, that also shows you whom he would have been dancing with, again could change his career quite drastically... and YES guys like Tunney WOULD be S-MW come L-HWs today.

but for all this agreement the 1930s - 60s / 70s was OVERALL the Best Years, with thee Greatest ever fighters, in Boxing History.

 

He me ignoring you.

 

You'll be banned soon anyway.

 

The 70's heavyweights till today are modern heavyweights. Which is why Foreman won the title in 74 and then again in 94. That is why Foreman fought guys like Everett Martin who also fought Wladimir Klitschko who in turn was heavyweight champion till a few years ago.

The "heavyweights" in the 1930's, 40's, 50's and 60's weren't modern sized heavyweights and for the most part weren't modern skilled heavyweights. Of course guys like Ali, Foreman, Frazier, Al Jones, ect actaully did turn pro in the 60's and were modern sized and modern skilled heavyweights.

How many people watching boxing now days has nothing to do with the point I made. I am talking about modern skills not who is currently watching modern boxing. Jack Johnson was considered skilled for late 1890s to early 1900's boxing. Compared to even somebody like Deontay Wilder he would be considered a drunken bar fighter now. The skills have evolved light years since then. Gene Tunney was considered skilled. Compared to even guys his size to day he wouldn't even by a top 1000 fighter in the world. The vast difference in athleticism, talent, skill is way too much for those primitive fighters back in the day.

If Rocky Marciano couldn't even beat slow 160 to 170 pound Ted Lowry then why would he even be able to compete with a guy like Roy Jones Jr? Never mind modern sized heavyweights like George Foreman, Gerry Cooney, Ron Lyle, Ken Norton, Al Jones, Leroy Jones, Roy "Tiger" Williams, Mike Tyson, Lennox Lewis, Riddick Bowe, Wladimir Klitschko, Anthony Joshua ect. Their skill level alone is far superior to what Marciano, Gene Tunney, Jack Dempsey, Sam Langford or any of these guys compete with then you add the athleticism and size to the equation? There is no way these guys from the past could compete. Even overrated guys like Joe Louis would be smashed by even a average modern sized cruiser weight. Joe Louis did fight a few bigger modern sized guys like Primo Carnera, Buddy Baer, Abe Simon but these guys were modern skilled, modernly athletic. Joe Louis stood right in front of you and couldn't take a punch. Even guys like light punching 160 pound Billy Conn shook him too his core. You think Mike Tyson wouldn't up destroyed him? I know what some of these old guys type. But Buster Douglas beat Tyson. Douglas was 6'3 230. He was a modern skilled guy. He fought in the modern era against modern sized guys. He beat Tyson but using his footwork to out box Tyson. Billy Conn was 5'11 160 pounds and couldn't punch but manage to out box Louis, out muscle him and hurt him with his punches.

So even the best so called heavyweights from the past couldn't compete with modern heavyweights.

 

who said anything about 'watching' boxing, I'm referring to the BOXERS and their Overall Skill...

WRONG, boxing is NOT Better, not even close.

we agree on Weight Divisions that fighters would fight in from then till now and likewise in the reverse... we even agree that the earlier times from the turn of the century up to about the 30s was 'less' athletic/stylish and skilled.

but we absolutely do not agree that 'today and recent years' is better than the Single Greatest Period(s) in Boxing History - the 1930s - 60s / 70s, no, No, NO is Is NOT, not at all. sorry.

 

Here we go. Size size and more size.

Have you ever asked yourself why it was that world class guys just as tall as McCall and Rahman never weighed 230 pounds before 1970?

Why do you think that was? Not guys taller then them. Just as tall. Find them. Give it some thought. Guys just as tall. They weighed less. Why was that?

 

They didn't have protein bars back then. Now you can take a protein bar with you wherever you go. You should try Quest. They have all kinds of flavours.

 

Yes that is partly only some of the answer. Mr Evan Fields might supply another..

Another question. Why was it guys just as tall had to weigh less back then?

 

1. To meet US military BMI requirements.

2. To keep up with the fast, skillful boxers back then.

3. To be able to go 15 rounds without gassing.

 

Tunney was 190 lbs cut. 190 lbs is not a SMW nor a LTHW. Tunney in the horrible shape of today’s hwts would be over 200 lbs. Tunney on ROIDS? Louis on ROIDS? Dempsey on ROIDS? The other thing of course is the ability to FIGHT. Fighters like Rahman were very slow, very low skilled fighters. Tunney, Louis, Dempsey were among the highest skills hwts ever to live.

 

yeah but today the 190lb man doesn't fight at that, he drops down to MW or S-MW or L-HW, thats exactly what Tunney or any of them would do, why would he remain at that weight when ALL his peers, RJJ, BHop, Calzaghe, Froch and the like drop down.

Nobody does different than the contemporary way... just the same in reverse IF these guys when back in time, they'd fight at in and around 180 plus pounds, they'd be L-HWs come HWs just like Tunney was in his era.

 

Tunney was a shredded 190 lb hwt. No chance at that stage of his career he makes the 175 lb limit. With ROIDS he would be +200 lbs.

 

Don't be so naive. It's evolution, son. We, as humans, have gotten bigger over time.

 

Personally I cant see much wrong with the 20s the decade gave us.
Tendler
Leonard
Callahan
Latzo
Greb
Walker
Loughran
Slattery
Tunney
Rosenbloom
Weinert
Dempsey
Wills
Sharkey
Gibbons
Berg
Milligan
Smith
Dundee J
Dundee V
Wolgast
Mclarnin
Mandell
Flowers
Battalino
Chocolate
Taylor
Hood
Harvey
Delaney
Berlenbach
Terris
Labarba
Genaro
Tarleton
Petrolle
Canzoneri
Norfolk
Villa
Corbett111
Fields
Plenty of skills there,imo