Liston wasn't in shape in their fight. His attempt to blind Ali was a desperate move by his corner. Sonny prepared for a 3 round fight. In 1960 Sonny wasnt only younger but he was in good condition and sharp. It would be a very different Liston. I still think Ali could edge him but I doubt its a stoppage.
I think it’s a much closer fight but Ali by UD or late stoppage. What’s largely forgotten about their first fight was Ali’s actual performance, everyone seems to concentrate on Sonny’s various shortcomings or problems, but Ali was superb in there. There really hadn’t been a heavyweight that looked like that up until then. Then when you consider his previous performance against Cooper and being decked, it just showed that even at that young age he had the discipline and mental application to carry out the game plan, and he would have still needed that against the dangerous 1960 version of Sonny. Overall I still think his speed of hand and foot would have presented too many issues for Sonny to solve who wasn’t the best at cutting off the ring. There would certainly be anxious moments for Ali though, Liston was a very good technician he’d be dangerous long into this fight but I think Ali would batter him in the last third to a UD or late round stoppage with Sonny still on his feet.
Never banned for 3 weeks could have been here on the 4th but have been looking at other forums. Banned once for a week several years ago, for overriding the *symbol,which I didn't know was not allowed. As usual you have your facts all wrong.No change there!
Not much would change except Liston lasts a little longer.......Liston was still slow off h and and foot, could not cut the Ring off and dropped his left every single time he threw his jab after he put everything into it......again Clay would counter Liston over it to death like in the actual match. Liston could never get used to Clays speed, full stop, and that would always be his undoing, has nothing to do with Clay having his number, speed of foot/hand plus footwork combined with a unorthodox reflex oriented defense was and always will be too much for slow Liston to overcome, the proof is in the pudding aka the actual fight.
Everyone makes excuses for Liston " He wasn't in shape" . Or he " Hurt his shoulder" or he was" old" Its always something to justify the so called most dangerous man on the planet losing to Clay ( He became Ali after he won the championship) So what's the excuse for the 2nd fight? The N.O.I intimidated him? The Mob made him take a dive? Etc, etc. Ali did to Liston what Liston did to so many others Ali with his physical ability, his wit, and his guts cracked that aura of invincibility and placed doubt in Liston mind. Ali punched Liston in the mouth 1st psychologically well before they met in the ring. And when the psychological warfare was backed up by the physical abilities and skills of Ali. Liston created away out. And I really don't see it being that big of a difference between 1960 Liston and 64. Sure Liston wasn't very active after 1960 . But that could've been a good thing with a lot less wear and tear on his body as far as we know. Liston doesn't beat Ali after 1964 regardless of what version of him is placed in the ring with Ali. Ali's foot and hand speed and mental toughness is simply wrong for Liston.
I didn't say that Liston would beat him. I said I think it would be a very tough fight but Ali would win a close decision. Whether it annoys you or not the truth is there was alot going on around Liston and also around Ali. I'm not saying I know myself. You have Mob ties, you have Liston's age, you have the NOI. We don't know. According to the doctor he had an injured shoulder. I guess that must have been a lie . It's fair to say dismissing all that, evidence suggests Liston didn't train like he once had. He may have just been complacent. Look at his weight. 218. He was fighting around 211-2 in 1960 if I remember correctly. That would be a clue he wasn't quite the same fighter. It seems like you bought into the easy journaliatic hook written by many Ali biographers and admirers. Ali punches Sonny in the mouth and and Liston packs it in out of some sort of cowardice. I don't buy it. This is a man who once fought with a broken jaw. A man who had taken harder shots from men more powerful than Ali by far.
Ali by decision. Still would've been too quick and elusive and would've had Sonny struggling to land more than one solid shot at a time. The fight would have been more competitive with Liston getting in better work, but in the end not enough to win or rock Ali enough to put him away. Liston would be getting popped with jabs and 1-2s just like he was in their actual fight and Ali's legs would prove to be too sturdy throughout the duration for Liston to finally corner him and put him down.
There is no such word as racistic ,neither was I banned for racial abuse.I was banned for making ,what could potentially be a racially inflammatory thread. Nothing I myself posted was racist in its content. A swift glance at my avatar would expose the absurdity of such an accusation. In the first instance I was not banned .I left this forum of my own accord ,voluntarily and without being banned. I then came back with a different user name.Never suspended for a month at any time in my 13 and a half years here. My recent ban was for 5 days. Several posters have been kind enough to welcome me back which I appreciate. Do you think they would do the same for you? You have made two posts on this my thread ,neither of them mentioned the subject of the thread, nor had anything to do with boxing in any way,they were just two inaccurate ,ill informed posts of spite ,and ignorance.Similar to the rest of your posts really! You Sir are a complete moron,why you choose to dig me out without the slightest provocation remains a mystery,but no matter ,nobody gives you any credibility or attention, least of all me.So crawl back into your sad little hole,you pathetic irrelevance! ps I've had 30 replies on this thread. Q.What did you get on your thread? A.One!lol
Here's your chance to clear up the facts. You said the ban was lifted on the 4th of November. What did you say do to get banned for in the first place?
