This is insane. Remember Pac was punching holes in Oscar and Margarito. Tank aint nowhere near that level
Yeah, well at his age 25. Pacquiao went through the gauntlet of tough mexican legends and Mexican warriors. Tank fighting Ricans and Cubans.. He was also just one dimensional at the time 1-2 1-1-2 no right hands to speak of and wild but was game as a pitbull in the ring.. He dropped all of them but just couldn't finish his ATG rival from Mehiko. If he had just more power Marquez would of been stopped. Tank is babied he is 25 ffs, fight the real dawgs, homie. like he say there is no safety on his glock. He should be having trilogies, rematches, WARS! etc etc. Then he back tracks and talks about taking his time because Loma is getting old. Come on now!
IMO, Pac is no exception to moving up in division. By the numbers, Pac 1st major fight is listed as 5'5 1/2 to MAB 5'6 (1/2 inch difference) @ weigh in MAB 126lbs Pac 125lb. Fight night MAB is 133lbs Pac 136lbs. How does Pac weighing 3lbs heavier than MAB equate to being the smaller guy @ 130lbs? Against Morales had gained 1lb more on fight night 140 vs 139. That's not a big difference to me. If, so then 3 he had over MAB should be 300% advantageous for Pac. If we flip the script -Floyd 1st title fight vs Hernandez 5'11 vs PBF @ 5'8. 3 inch disparity, yet I don't give him credit. You move up, U were the little guy, now you are in a new weight class. Again which fighters who moved up are considered the heavier guy? Why isn't it fare to ask at 23 fights per piece whose punch made more noise? That is how I make the comparison, not by who fought in the amateurs longer. Same with Larry Holmes, Mike Tyson had less than what 40 -50 fights as an amateur? Rocky Marciano went 8-4 as an amateur then went to play baseball, yet retired 49-0 as a pro boxer whose claim to fame was power hitter. It didn't come from ams, IMO just like Tank's power or Pac's power. Natural. Hundreds of boxers won titles or became greats of their era by developing as a pro. You can call him an amateur in his 1st pro fights but again; how does that equate to his punching power? In theory I agree, but realistically American amateurs have not run through their opponents since the 1990s. Wilder the least in amateur experience came away with the sole American to get a medal . Rakhim Chakhkiev won the gold correct? And he's caught several beatdowns by nobodies as a pro. Clemente Russo took silver over Wilder...and he's lost 5 out of his last 6 fights. Previous Olympics America produced Dirrell at Bronze, he's been run through and over, yet an extensive amateur career like Tank. But it didn't translate into power, let alone proving his amateur experience would mean he could do well as a pro. Take them away? LOL! At this point with his supposed skills and polishness I wouldn't choose him over MAB, Morales or JMM. I'm simply sticking to one script- who punches harder Pac or Tank. The 1st 5 guys that Pac won decisions over weren't polished. yet everyone of these guys who took him the distance were all KO'd at least twice before taking him on. So that wasn't a lack of amateur experience that prevented him from using power to stop those guys. I don't give or add points for being a great amateur since many greats relied on skill not ko power. Davis stopping his opponents is not based on his amateur experience. He simply sets down on his punches. He's a compact guy & Usually flatfooted when he throws, so it's inevitable he will generate stoppages against lower tier fighters unlike Pac who couldn't stop all the low-tier fighters he faced. And when he dropped the big names MAB, JMM, they were an accumulation, not one time did he do to them what he did to Lucero ora top fighter in Hatton- a guy even Mayweather stopped. The KO of Hatton didn't happen often with Pac. A well disciplined Manny with amateur experience may have never drew us to him. Just hearing the nicknames added to him while watching his many fights bare witness "Manny is a tornado." Manny is a whirlwind tsunami." Manny's speed is overwhelming his foes with punches coming from every angle to which they can't see." That is how he stopped his foes. Tank can overwhelm like Pac, but he can also end it with a 1-2 more often than Pac did -when he like Tank were fighting for titles against no-namers in general. This content is protected At age 25 Pac was in the game for 8 years. Tank in for 6 years. You can go by age, I go by when they turned pro. 19 Tank 17 Pac. 23 fights in is where I draw the line because again- That is his age in ring years 23 fights. Who were these great Mexican he fought at this stage of he & Tank's career? Manny was 22-1 8 decisions against guys in the same weight class as Pac. Same limited amateur experience. None of these guys had an advantage as their records speak such. They were KO'd by fighters b4 & after Pac. Whereas Tank, rolled over his no-namers. Agreed, but wasn't that wildness what drew us to him? Could it be that settling him down also helped to diminish his stoppage %? I prefer to discount them because again- he didn't face them within 23 fights where Tank is now. & nobody stopped JMM. No knock on Pac. Yes, as @dangerousity stated- he has quite a bit longer amateur career than did Pac so he turned pro at a later age as a result. Who are these fighters you can name that has had trilogies within 23 fights within 6 years? 10 + Decades of boxing, that is a rarity to name boxers (plural) with a resume in our whole history of pugilism. Let's keep it in context. It seems you are discussing their careers-I'm discussing the topic-which is a bit hard to cordon-off. Power at 135 or 140 who has more? So I looked at facts- @135lb division Pac fought once. So I had to look at where he fought more than 1x to compare power-. I Couldn't go beyond 140 because he was already 40 fights old by that weight class. How does one compare the power of a person who had 40 fights vs 23 fights, fair & objectively? @ 40 fights Pac fought killers. @ 23 fights he hadn't. Repetitive- why 23 fights as the measurement? That is how many fights Tank has had. Took Pac 8 years to get that 1st big name (age 25). So when Tank is in his 8th year, I will hold him to that standard as well. As for now within 6 years- Pac's big name was Ledwaba. Tank's biggest name in 6 years is a faded Gamboa & Cristobol Cruz. Tank has also faced 3 undefeated fighters in a row 22-0 21-0 19-0. Pac faced 3 undefeated 19-0 23-0 & the 18-0 foe stopped Pac. Lastly- I think it is shameful Tank is talking himself the cash cow. I'm not a fan of Tank, I'm just stating at 23 fights he has shown to be a power little tank. I wouldn't be sad if someone KO's him or Ernie Terrel him aka beat him down all night!
Fight night weights are not official weights, Pac wears shoes, jackets, sunglasses, change etc for his fight night weight. It’s basically with clothes on. If Pac is wearing a jacket and mab is not then that adds that extra 3lbs alone. You can basically weigh in with clothes on and commentators have said Pac weighs with clothes on, that’s why it’s called “unofficial” weight. The biggest indicator is their weigh-in weight, cos if you’re a guy who’s gonna rehydrate 10lbs, if lb matters in losing that weight. Why would Pac come in at 125 and mab at 126? That’s because mab was near his minimum limit whereas Pac could have probably forced himself to 122. It’s also pretty common sense, when fights move up their fight night weight moves up massively. That’s because they got bigger as they moved up. PACs fight night weight remained pretty static, that’s because he was always a small guy and remains a small guy when he moved up, he didnt get bigger. His fight night weights remained in line with those at 126-130 until he moved up to 140-147. Guys at 147 weight 155-165 at fight night. PACs fight night weight at LW was 144 and his fight night weight at 147 was 145 for odlh fight, does that make sense to you? May have even been less, he weighed in at 142 officially, he couldn’t even make the weight up when he tried. Has anyone else ever done that? This backed up by his 8000 calories a day diet. I’ll get back on the rest later.
So you are saying every fight on fight night he comes in wearing street clothes? Not for the official weigh in, but on fight night? Do yo have links or videos? Why do you think he made a habit of wearing clothes the day of the weigh in? And why do all his clothes seem to have same material/weight has he has constantly weighed on fight night between 144-147 for a decade plus, what is the purpose? I don't know why Pac weighed 1 pound under & MAB on weight, anymore than how MAB re hydrated in a division he had been in, while Pac moving up somehow re-hydrated because of his clothes? So the clothes made him 3lbs heavier? If so, then he has been lying claiming he re-hydrates, but in reality: , Pac wears shoes, jackets, sunglasses, change etc for his fight night weight That has been my point, When Pac moved up he wasn't always the smaller guy. Against MAB he outweighed him by 3 lbs. Now only you know how much of it was street clothes! And not every person who weighs in the day before re-hydrates. Joe Calzaghe usually came in fight night 166-168lbs. Some stay the same , some a few lbs & some will come in 10-15lbs heavier. To which Pac does as well. He was a Welter fighting at 135. Unless it's street clothes. And when contracted for Junior Middle which is 154...again he came in around 147. I choose think his fight night is based on what is always said on tale of the tape. Manny rehydrated, not put on some bling bling and some blue jeans and shoes on the scale. Than how did he win in 8 different weight classes? This is {MY} example of a small fighter beating a big fighter: Henry Armstrong, at 133½ pounds, beat Ross, at 142 pounds. Which fights? Again when he competed at 126, he didn't weight that on fight night. Same for 130- he was consistent at being close to 139, how does that make him the smaller guy? Same for 135 he came in same weight as Diaz. Same for 140, usually contracted as catchweight. Please do. No rush. Since every fight I named his weight, counter it so I can understand how you feel he came in on fight night as the smaller guy. Height wise? Tank fits in that same 5'5 1/2 club.
It would just be habits. Pac didn’t care about fight night weights so he weighed with clothes on. I would need to find the exact fight but lampley basically said that unofficial weight that Pac weighed for included clothes on. That doesn’t just apply for Pac, that could be any fighter depending on how they want to manipulate their weight. If someone wanted to appear as a smaller guy then they would probably weigh in with no clothes, if someone wants to come off as a bigger guy they would weigh in with rocks in their pockets. The point being that fight night weight is next to useless to use as the basis for what their weight actually is, unless it’s significant difference (you couldn’t make up 10lbs in clothes). For example, you’re making massive assumptions that mab wore the same weight clothes as Pac on fight night. The closest thing you have is their walking around weight, their weigh in weight and to an extent fight night weight. When Pac fought morales, morales was the one who was dehydrated, why was that? If he wasn’t the bigger man. When Pac fought Hatton, he came in at 138. When he fought Margarito at 154, he came in at 144. When he fought mab he weighed in 125. Does he just have a broken scale? Or is this a guy just coming in at a comfortable weight and not even trying and then after a night of drinking, eating and weighing with clothes on, weighs more on fight night? That’s the difference. At 140+ Pac was basically fighting at walking around weight, which is extremely small since everyone else are naturally 10-20lbs higher than their fighting weight. Which is why he makes the weight and then some. Meanwhile, other fighters are dehydrating and barely getting by in making the weight. So if Pac is walking around 145 naked, then that makes him a LW. As the average LW is a 145 man. He’s basically a 145lb man at this point. And 6-7lbs weight growth from 126-147 is tiny, usually fighters would put on an extra 20-30lb on fight night weight then. Here’s my thoughts on his actual size. He was growing up at 106-118. 122 was a bit like Morales at 126-130, he was that weight once and most effective in terms of power to weight ratio but with age outgrew it. At 122 he’s a big guy like morales was a big 126-130. At 126-130 he was probably mid range, some guys were bigger and some were smaller. At 135+ he was tiny, any and every 135 fighter walks around bigger than he does at LW. Look at khan, Rios, Algeri, Crawford etc. At 140-147 it’s just taking the ****. So pac’s Prime physical weight if he wants to take advantage of his power to weight ratio would be 130-135. His fight night weight of 139-144 would be in line weight that, gaining an additional 9-10lbs after a good meal, water and clothes, which is the case for most fighters at a healthy fight weight. Edit: re Diaz and Pac same weight. Again, I don’t think so. Pac previously made 130 whereas Diaz was at 135, you don’t fight at a higher weight for no reason. Second, on their 30 day weigh in Diaz was 145lb whereas Pac was reported 139lb few days after. So how is it possible Pac weighs more on fight night than 30 days before the fight? Lol, difference is those 30 day weigh ins are bare, fight night is with clothes. Again same with Pac Floyd, Pac was 143lb a few days before the fight with Floyd. And he actually weighs in heavier on fight night. He’s not losing extra weight because he has to, hes just going into his natural weight. If his natural weight is 143 at 147 after 10 years there, that would still be small for a LW since most LWs are natural 145+. Pac looks physically much bigger now than he did at 130, like 10lb bigger, but fight night weights don’t show it.
No sir, I go by tale of the tape. This is the first I've ever heard about fighters wearing clothes the day of the fight. This content is protected 8:32 in it state they rehydrated. Every fight I've ever watched always has a tale of the tape. Never seen, nor read of anyone wearing clothes, rather the day of the fight - now the day before (official weigh in)they on occasion will strip down to their undies or ass butt naked to make weight. I've never seen one instance in 35 years of someone being recorded wearing clothes on fight night & getting on a scale with them. It has always been 1. Fighter is shown weighing the day before & 2-. fighters tale of the tape usually after every anthem is sung- then measurements- & who hydrated the most overnight. This content is protected 27 seconds in they say "He will go in the larger man" Nothing about a 2nd weigh in with clothes he is now at 136lbs. What for? We see it totally different. But it is what it is....again any video you have with any fighter being recorded the day of the fight? On a scale with clothes on, I would love to see. One more at 7:35 in--I quote Jim Lamply- " it is Pacquaio's first fight at 130lbs. Pac made the limit while Erik had to take off all of his clothes to weigh in at 130. Tonight Morales put on 10lbs. Pacquiao 9lbs"to go up to 139lbs. ---Nowhere do they say Pac put on some clothes to make him go from 129 1/2lbs up to 139lbs. Now he's gonna take it off to put him back at 129 1/2lbs. This content is protected
It is a quick courtesy some boxers give as they head to their dressing room. The unofficial weight is with the cloths, jewelry, phone, wallet, and anything else on their person. Also using an un-official scale. They do not strip down to their underwear. If you think otherwise you are mistaken. Many boxers have stated so.
Yes sir, they do strip down to their undies on the (official) weigh in. I've never seen an unofficial weigh in. again I just quote what I understand- fighters rehydrate.
I saw it on an HBO telecast. I can't recall the fight but he had just arrived at the stadium. An HBO crew with a scale was in his dressing room and asked for an un-official weigh in. He obliged and got on scale with everything he was wearing. Recall he was joking about his watch and wallet adding extra weight.
At welterweight, Pac dropped: Cotto 2X Bradley 3X Algieri 6X Vargas 1X Mosley 1X Marquez 1X Matthysse 3X Thurman "One Time" (lol) And he managed to hurt: Rios Mayweather Broner Horn Clottey Pac would have violently smoked the Gamboa Tank fought in under 3 rounds. Floyd walked down Mosley, Berto, Maidana, Ortiz, Guerrero, and Canelo, but played it extra safe w/ Pac and he still got buzzed 2X. Mosley ran for survival from Pac, but stood toe to toe w/ the much bigger Canelo after. Beyond a shadow of a doubt, Pac punches harder than Tank. Unless Tank starts hurting and dropping welterweights that outweigh him by 10-20 pounds, there's no use debating it because it's not debatable.
Lol trust me they wear clothes or they can choose to, I’ll find it but I promise you I’m not making this **** up. I’ve seen a weigh in in one of the fights in fight night, for some reason hbo stopped showing it in later fights. Put it this way, Pac weight 138 for a fight with Hatton at 140, he weight 142 for a 147 fight with odlh, he weighed 144 for a 150 fight with Margo. You simply don’t dehydrate an extra 2-6lbs for fun or because you can. If you go significantly under the weight limit you did 1 of 2 things: 1) your nutrition coach sucks and has fked up your weight badly! In this case Pac is doing it repeatedly. 2) you simply don’t weigh anymore than that, that’s what you are soaking wet, so you’re not gonna weigh anymore. So if you weigh 144 for a fight and weigh 148 on fight night, if the fight is 150, why in the world did you fk your body up by dehydrating a further 6lbs for NO reason?? Does that make any sense to you? That 4lbs can only be clothes. As for rehydration, of course in 99% of the cases people used it for rehydration. As did Pac from 112-135. But it’s like if Pac was fighting at MW now, do you think he would need to. Dehydrate on fight night? He’ll probably weigh 146 on weigh in and then weigh 150 fight night for a fight at 160, do you really think he would still be dehydrating to 146 and dehydrating to 150 then? That’s essentially what he did at JMW. Edit: finding the vid is gonna be like needle in haystack, I definitely remember it one of the pre fight stuff hbo showed, jackets on and everything. In fact here is John Molina being quoted on it from the scene: “In Molina's fight with Ruslan he exposed how Showtime does it. Basically the interviewer asked him about his weight and quoted the unofficial weight Showtime listed in the tale of the tape. And Molina flat out said that weight is bogus no way I weigh that much you guys had me step on a scale with shoes and all my clothes on, I had my wallet, phone, keys in my jeans. I think these networks either flat out make up the weights or have them step on a scale but there is no consistency or accuracy if guys are weighed with full clothes 5 mins after they get to the arena.” If you google hbo unofficial weight on the scene you will find a thread on how it works too. That’s where that John Molina bit comes from, including people watching the same telecasts of people weighing in with clothes and Jim Langley confirming that unofficial weight can be with clothes on. That’s why it’s unofficial because it’s not part of the rules and fighters do it as a courtesy to HBO so hbo can have some talking points, so at that point when HBO gives them a scale, a fighter can choose to strip down or weigh with clothes. It’s a lot like compubox in that it can tell you something (like Chavez obvious weight gain) or it could be utter rubbish.
yeah the poll does state 2 weights 135 & 140. I didn't use Welter, because he hasn't fought at welter so its all speculative as to what he'd do at a weight he isn't at. It isnt debatable as to who Pac did & didn't KO in his 23 fights compared to Tank's. Again I never said he was stronger I said he has KO'd all first 22 out of 23 t-cans. Pac didn't KO all his t-cans, I named them.
No major. I know there is an unofficial weigh in. I just don't quote it, cause I've never viewed or listened to a commentator state what was worn on the day of fight. Not questioning you, I just chose my side - Im sticking with rehydration cause I don't know how much of their jeans contributed to weight gain. How heavy is their sneakers and jewelry!
