Basilio or Fullmer? We all know Fullmer won both fights but he was also the natural middle and Basilio had millage by then. Both have excellent wins. Both aggressive in different ways. They both have superb conditioning and rock jaws Who you got and why
Basilio for me. He's actually a little underrated technically and not just the tough, clubbing brawler he's often painted as. Fullmer has the wins over him, and they were great fights to watch, but I think he got Basilio at a good time when Carmen was on the slide. And as you allude to, he wasn't the natural Middleweight of the pair. I'd probably have Basilio inside my top fifteen Welters, and his Middleweight credentials aren't bad either. Fullmer could be inside a top dozen Middleweights on a good day, I guess, but Basilio's achievements across two weights and his (in my opinion) superior talent swing it in his favour and just about offset those losses to Gene.
Another vote for The Onion Farmer. Fullmer was a savage ******* who came out like a menace. He had an underrated jab and his head-movement was good too. Below average power but threw so much with such a mean-streak that it didn't matter. He got the job done with it. I didn't wanna be on the recieving end of those body shots. Carmen was a better technician IMO. He had his crafty head-movement, good positioning to find the body, a nice jab and a style which lent itself to throwing aggressive counters in a Duran-escque fashion. He wasn't as impressive physically, as he clearly wasn't as strong or as hard a puncher but he was smaller so it's allowed. He was just as well-conditioned, just as tough (maybe moreso) and IMO more exciting. As for their actual fights (both amazing fights, although I definitely preferred the first) and I don't think the result is telling for who's the better fighter. Carmen was getting on, he was naturally smaller, he was coming off the back of a long career and they were still very competitive. The bigger guy should've won that fight, and credit to Fullmer coz he did. I don't have Fullmer in my top 20 MWs, I think a bit of home cooking and good-luck helped him out during his career. Basilio may have benefited from this too, but to my knowledge he was jobbed in the Davey fight, and he says in the Gavilan and Graham fights. I didn't think the fight with thd Kid was a robbery. So yeah, I don't have Gene in my top 20 MWs, but I'd probably have Carmen in my top 20 WWs (it's under-revision, I did last time). P4P is clearly for Carmen too IMO. The WW fought MWs, and the MW fought WWs.
Mmmm, 88 chris has Basilio in top 15, you George have him in your top 20, I have him breaking ( or not far off ) my top ten, so after ( any order you chose ) Armstrong. Napoles. Robinson, Britton, Walker, Ross, Leonard, maybe Hearns, there sits Basilio. No !
Carmen by a mile I think. He achieved more but he also passed the eye test. Gene was a roughouse got away with alot of fouling. Basilio was rough too but I dont think he depended on that to the same extent. Carmen threw crisp combos, moved his head slickly on defense
Agree with all of this. I have Carmen as a top 15 welter (just). I don't think he beat Gavilan but he gave him all he could handle. Like @88Chris05 said, Basilio is often portrayed as just a slugger but he boxed off an educated jab that would put most of today's fighters to shame and he put his punches together well. He was clearly a greater fighter than Fullmer when you add his middleweight title to his achievements at welter and he was a better figther too - he just met Fullmer at the wrong time. Had it been two years earlier than their first fight, I think Basilio would have won.
