V Vitali v Byrd? Did Liston quit with a broken jaw or did he continue to lose a split dec? Did he quit with a broken nose against big punching Williams, or did he regroup and take him out?
My Ring magazines of that time say otherwise! "In 12-Rounder Liston Is Decision Victor Over Machen United Press International, September 8, 1960 SEATTLE (UPl) — Sonny Liston, who scored a unanimous decision over Eddie Machen in a 12-round nationally televised match here Wednesday night, today continued his cry for a title match with heavyweight champion Floyd Patterson." " Liston's streak of nine straight knockout victories ended when he won a unanimous twelve-round decision against Eddie Machen on September 7, 1960. Machen's mobility enabled him to go the distance but he was clearly outpointed despite Liston being penalised for a low blow in the 11th round." http://www.eyeonthering.com/boxing/sonny-liston-vs-eddie-machen Tell you what, you produce two contemporary reports that say otherwise.
no thnx, I believe you. However, I do not agree about who won the fight. Just something you'll have to live with.
I've boxed with a torn rotator cuff. You can still throw punches with the arm, but you don't have the full range of movement. I tend to think Liston thought things weren't going his way
Floyd Patterson won a unanimous decision over Eddie Machen on July 5 1964, and Ernie Terrell won a decision over Eddie Machen for the vacant WBA title on March 5 1965, does those victories on points make those two fighters less than good fighters because they could not knockout Eddie as Ingemar Johannson did on Sept 14 1958?. An older Eddie Machen defeated a up and coming Jerry Quarry on July 14 1966, by decision, he schooled him.
Bowe got hit often - both men pretty slow - getting hit often not a good thing against Liston but Bowe could punch a bit also and would have advantages that Liston never faced- this fight would most likely go into later rounds and could be a corner stop or a decision win - generally speaking Bowe was the less conditioned of the 2 - hard fight to pick - toss up
Yeah, that's why Ali also stopped Foreman and Frazier. He couldn't punch after all! Seriously, Liston fought many powerful punchers. Many of his opponents were stronger punchers than Ali.
I pick Liston here. I think Liston wins the battle of the mid range jabs, but more importantly this is a fight where both will be walking forward and neither will be clinching. So it comes down to who can win the exchange and back his man up in the follow up. Who's strong enough to make the other man give up ground. Liston gets off first in the pocket and ultimately Bowe is just too hittable to be taking bombs from Liston. What Bowe has in his favour is he'll keep coming all night so Liston will need to be on his A Game, but I think he stops Bowe or pounds out a wide decision.
I'm actually very impressed with Machen's performance, though I agree with the judges that he lost the fight. Machen often used excellent movement and a snappy left hook to keep the big man away. Had he a better jab he probably would have won the fight. I'm not familiar with his career outside of this fight, the Frazier and Johanssen, but I wouldn't be surprised if this was his career best effort. I did see Liston staying busy, being the aggressor, and working the body more. That won him the fight in my eyes by three points. I don't want to take anything away from Machen though, he really did look world-class here. I'm actually surprised this is the guy who got knocked the yee-haw out of by Johanssen.
Despite a lot of good wins throughout his career (Jerry Quarry, Doug Jones, Nino Valdes, Tommy Jackson, etc.), I think this was Machen's best performance (on film). Unfortunately, I'm the only one who thinks Machen defeated Liston.
He has the first Lewis - Holyfield as one of the biggest robberies of all time. He scored it strongly for Holyfield.
I just didn't think Machen landed solid enough blows with any consistency. Liston really didn't look moved much, where Machen definitely made it obvious during more than a few of the blows (particularly to the body) that he was not having a Howdy Doody day. Machen also retreated a lot without throwing much, including (bizarrely) the jab. It really intrigues me what his corner told him in between rounds, because I personally would have slapped him into jabbing, jabbing, jabbing, and hooking off the jab. As I mentioned earlier, had he employed those punches he very well might have convincingly won. Liston just looked busy, aggressive, focused. But then, I scored Hagler-Leonard three points for Hagler. Aggression over movement, specifically when the aggressor is throwing (and at least most of the time landing) the more significant punches. So please keep that in mind. Different strokes.
